Beer you say?

[vroomery]

Just wondering what types of beer people prefer. The Sam Adams Oktoberfest has just become in season again and I am enjoying one as we speak. What else you guys (and gals) getting in to?

[luvmyshiner]

Heh, heh, a topic made just for me (and Marnold).:bravo:

Love Sam Adams, and of course, I have to mention my favorite, SHINER.:master:

http://www.shiner.com/

But lately I've been drinking a lot of St. Arnolds Elissa IPA. Texas' oldest micro brewery.

http://www.saintarnold.com/

[MichaelE]

Paulaner, Paulaner Oktoberfest, Paulaner Salvator, Spaten, Spaten Oktoberfest, Ayinger 100 Jahr, Ayinger Dunkle, Hofbräuhaus (HB), Weihenstephan, and probably others I'm forgetting as well.

[Spudman]

Cold is my first choice. My second is a room temp Guinness. I generally like a thick chewy beer since I don't drink much. I like quality over quantity.

[Kodiak3D]

I generally like a thick chewy beer since I don't drink much. I like quality over quantity.

Ditto. On the rare occasion I drink a beer (VERY rare), I'll take a Guiness or something else dark and thick.

[Spudman]

Ditto. On the rare occasion I drink a beer (VERY rare), I'll take a Guiness or something else dark and thick.
:beer:

(disclaimer: I am not encouraging drinking ;) )

[Robert]

I like ale. I am weak for Guiness. Sam Adams is pretty good. My new favorite is Tank House Ale, from Toronto.

Ya'll should try this one http://www.ratebeer.com/beer/st-ambroise-oatmeal-stout/839/92057/
St. Ambroise Oatmeal Stout. Wicked!

[sunvalleylaw]

Beer is generally my drink of choice if I am drinking, other than red wine on occasion. I go for quality over quantity as well. My favorites come from the IPA variety, American, West Coast particularly. Stone Ruination IPA, Deschutes Organic Green Lakes, Long Hammer IPA from Red Hook, and Sierra Nevada Pale are some favorites. Guiness or a really good Oatmeal stout is my other favorite style. And I also like Arrogant Bastard from Stone Brewing as well, for a malty choice. I love Christmas brews, with often Deschutes JubleAle being a favorite commercial offering I can get. But I like my own homebrewed Christmas brew the best of the Christmas brews. I have not made any in a while. A couple are plenty, high octane.

My favorite, really cold, lawn mower beer from a can is PBR.

[peachhead]

Wow, SVL, I don't think I have ever known someone to admit they like PBR. Very cool!
I'm an MGD man myself, it's been my favorite for years. I like Sam Adams, Killians, Newcastle, and although I don't find it here much, Abita Amber. I like trying something new whenever I go somewhere away from home.

[SuperSwede]

I love ale, especially Bishops Finger.. But I also love a smooth ice cold Carlsberg or Tuborg. MMMmmm beeerrr

[deeaa]

I don't really care, as long as its wet and has alcohol it's OK. Doesn't have to be even really cold or anything. Except for wheat beers and many ales; those taste too yeasty when lukewarm.

I prefer *tasty* lagers, like Karhu, and stuff like Velkopopovicky. Kozel dark etc. when I want a great taste. Carlsberg, Beck's, etc. are great on the tap, bottled just as good as any other beer. I generally dislike too much hops bitterness and prefer a rye-kind of sturdy taste more.

But..any basic lager, most ales, it's just great by me...I haven't really drank much american beers but all I've tried are just fine by me, Miller, Coors, Budweiser, all good, quite tasteless and light beers which go down just great. I always drank Milwaukee's Best when in the U.S. because it was the cheapest, and actually had some more taste to it too. With Milwaukee's I also learned the 'shotgun' trick to down a few beers in just a few minutes :-)

But all in all I don't care much. Of late I've been buying these half-litre cans of this 'light' beer that has like 50% less calories...tastes watery but I don't care. I drink a few of those every day and think it's best to watch the calories a little and they still give the same buzz.

Yesterday I however drank a couple normal 'Koff' beers and a whisky chaser (Ballantines) before bed. Which reminds me, gotta go to the store to get some beer, the fridge is empty!

[vroomery]

There are some great beers listed here. I am also a fan of a guiness extra stout at a little bellow room temp. It gets too bitter when its cold. Killians Irish Red is tasty as well. I'm usually not too big of a fan of IPA's b/c the ibu is typically pretty high. If i want something that goes down pretty easy but still has flavor I'll go for beck's or red stripe, and I haven't tried an Oktoberfest style beer that I haven't liked. The Spaten Oktoberfest is pretty darn good along with the Sam Adams Oktoberfest.

[duhvoodooman]

The Spaten Oktoberfest is pretty darn good along with the Sam Adams Oktoberfest.
What a coinky-dink! I had the Sam Adams Oktoberfest last week and bought a 12-pack of the Spaten two days ago. It's the time of year!

Other personal favorites: Stella Artois, Newcastle, Smithwick's, Pilsner Urquell, Blue Moon, any well-made Hefeweizen during hot weather, several of the other Sam Adams brews. And one called De Koninck that I had in Antwerp while traveling on business that I'd love to find here in the States....

[Tone2TheBone]

You beer snobs. ;) Guinness, Newcastle, Bass, Leffe, Sol, this German beer I can't remember (help me out beer snobs) and the usual cheap BBQ beer. I love alcohol so yeah I like to drink me some beers. :)

[duhvoodooman]

Ah, yes--Leffe! Another great Belgian brew I forgot to mention! :AOK:

And St. Pauli Girl! Can't forget that one....

[sunvalleylaw]

Wow, SVL, I don't think I have ever known someone to admit they like PBR. Very cool!
I'm an MGD man myself, it's been my favorite for years.
I normally would much rather have one of the others I listed, but for "lawnmower beer", Peeber does just fine. It has to be iceee cold though. MGD used to be my favorite American cheap beer. Henry Weinhards I used to like. But PBR is cheaper, and just fine. I do not really like Bud at all. Has rice in it. As a homebrewer, I cannot abide that, and it tastes funny to me. I don't get the Rolling Rock thing either. Rice and Corn in that one. Corn sugar is sometimes used in home brewing in very small quantities to pressurize bottles by "bumping" the yeast as the beer is bottled, but should not be used as a fermentation sugar. Bleh!

[FrankenFretter]

I rarely drink anymore, but I prefer stouts and porters most of the year, with the exception being summer, when I prefer pales, ambers and brown ales. Some of my favorites are; Black Butte Porter and Obsidian Stout, both from Deschutes, and of course, Guinness. I also love Rasputin Imperial Stout, almost anything from Hale's brewery, and Mirror Pond Pale. Lately I drink more wine than beer, although it's Port, so it's not your everyday run of the mill red wine. I will not drink Merlot with those people!

[street music]

generally like a thick chewy steak since I don't drink much. I like quality over quantity. Modified to make my hunger go away. Beer isn't one of my favorite drinks, however I do like Strum's beer girls if that counts for great taste.

[sumitomo]

I haven't drank for over 5 yrs,but I used to like my beer after work,it was always Mirror Pond Ale,that stuff was great and it had to be cold to get the proper taste.Then the changed the way it was made they took away the krausening so no sedments in the bottle and it took away the flavor so I then switched to Becks,and now watch out cause I'm a juice head I make all kinds of my own juice.Sumi:D

[Kazz]

I am with Spud.....COLD is my favorite....for years when I was a young guy....not quite fully sarcastic yet :-) I drank Bud Light several nights a week as I was out playing in pool leagues....as I got older and moved to Oregon...I found Micro Brews...Hefeweizen with a chunk of orange is now my favorite.....I still dabble with the occasional Bud Light...or Heineken another favorite...or an ice cold Corona with lime. Yummo

[Kazz]

generally like a thick chewy steak since I don't drink much. I like quality over quantity. Modified to make my hunger go away. Beer isn't one of my favorite drinks, however I do like Strum's beer girls if that counts for great taste.


It counts Street....it definitely counts.

[Tig]

Ditto. On the rare occasion I drink a beer (VERY rare), I'll take a Guiness or something else dark and thick.

Ditto plus 11'ty. Quality over quantity.
I can't stand the American macro brewery swill p-p water! :nono: :puke:

[luvmyshiner]

I'm glad to see we don't have any Coors Light fans here. If I want to drink warm piss, I can make my own.:messedup:

[street music]

Hey what has become of JUST STRUM, I haven't seen him post lately?? I know he doesn't drink much anymore but I expected his girls to show up for this thread.

[hubberjub]

I have been doing a lot of Dogfish Head recently (60, 90, and 120 minute) but I also enjoy a few from Saranac brewery. You've got to support the locals.

[rylanmartin]

My current favourites in no particular order:
McEwans Scotch Ale, Innis & Gunn Whiskey Aged, Okanagan Springs Porter, Amber's Brewery (here in Edmonton) Australian Mountain Pepper Berry, and my plain standard would probably be Moosehead Lager...

[Robert]

I just found some new beers in a liquor store. I bought them both, having a Trois Pistoles right now. :beer:

Trois Pistoles
Maudite

Both from Quebec.

Oh man, these things are strong! 9 and 8 % - more than I am used to.

Good ratings:
http://beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/22/30
http://www.ratebeer.com/beer/unibroue-trois-pistoles/1926/

http://www.ratebeer.com/beer/unibroue-maudite/1921/
http://beeradvocate.com/beer/profile/22/33

[rylanmartin]

I just found some new beers in a liquor store. I bought them both, having a Trois Pistoles right now. :beer:

Trois Pistoles
Maudite

Both from Quebec.

Oh man, these things are strong! 9 and 8 % - more than I am used to.

OOOoooo...a little Unibroue, hey? You should've tried a 2004 cranberry something or other they made...a little girly, but still pretty awesome. The "Blanche de Chambly" is also very nice, I believe a bit cloudy, but nice. Did you buy the "wine bottle" Unibroue??

[Robert]

No Rylan, I just went with the only Unibroue products in the store... these beers are growing on me though, especially the more I have of them... :messedup:

[sunvalleylaw]

UniBrow product?

http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w92/sunvalleylaw/images-1.jpg

[Spudman]

This is great. You guys have mentioned a whole bunch of beers I've never tried. After I rob a bank I think I'll go on a beer spree.

[marnold]

I like the beer I make, although the Oatmeal Stout I made just ran out. I made a Duessedorfer-style Altbier that was to die for. Generally speaking I prefer heavier/more bitter beers and then enjoy them for a good long while. I've always got to mind my Ps and Qs of course, especially since I'm on call 24/7. Sometimes I make a low-gravity beer like a Mild or Ordinary Bitter for all that beery goodness yet with low alcohol.

Rather than favorite beers, my favorite style are:
Duesseldorfer-style Altbier (e.g. Zum Uerige)
IPA (I make one briefly titled "Lion Fan in Packerland Extremely Bitter IPA")
Doppelbock (Paulaner Salvator will be the beer on tap in heaven)
Barleywine/Imperial Stout
Tripel (Chimay White aka Cinq Cents)
Lambics, especially Gueuze or Kriek (Boon Mariage Parfait is wonderful but almost impossible to find anymore)--generally speaking Lambic tends to be the one beer style that even beer geeks don't like. It's not for the faint of palate.
Bohemian Pilsner (Pilsner Urquell or Budvar/Czechvar)

Actually it's easier for me to say the beer styles I don't like. Obviously I don't much care for American mega stuff, although a Leinies isn't 1/2 bad in a pinch. I also don't really like Bavarian wheat beers. Not a fan of cloves, unfortunately.

[MichaelE]

As much as I love German beer, especially Bavarian brews, Weisen has never been one of my favorites either. Much to acidy for me and I don't care for the aftertaste because of it.

I never tried a Weisen I really liked.

[ZMAN]

I like Carlsberg, and Faxe Piilsener, Amber and Festbock. I can never find them when I am in Maine. When I am in the US I like MGD, Killians, Icehouse, and one of my all time favourites. Old Milwaukee. In the craft brew section a brewery in the Topsham,and Bangor Maine area is the Sea Dog Brewing Co, They have some fine ales and beers.
Another thing that really makes me mad is buying a dozen Molson Canadian beers in Maine for 8.59 plus 60 cents deposit, and paying 19.95 for the same thing in Canada.

[sunvalleylaw]

As much as I love German beer, especially Bavarian brews, Weisen has never been one of my favorites either. Much to acidy for me and I don't care for the aftertaste because of it.

I never tried a Weisen I really liked.

Generally, I agree for commercial Weizen, though I bet there are some amazing homebrews out there in that style. I tried a Sierra Nevada Weizen (Kellerweiss) a week or two ago, and it was quite good on a hot summer eve!

[Eric]

I have been doing a lot of Dogfish Head recently (60, 90, and 120 minute) but I also enjoy a few from Saranac brewery. You've got to support the locals.

+1. I was just getting ready to sing the praises of 60 minute IPA when I saw your post. That's top-5 for me.

My favorite styles are probably American IPAs, APAs, German Pilseners/Lagers, and maybe Brown Ales. For cheap beer, Yuengling or Miller Lite are both OK. I guess those are my 'lawnmower beers.'

Oddly, I've never actually had Guinness.

[mjk123]

how about "Free Beer"...?

[Eric]

Bohemian Pilsner (Pilsner Urquell or Budvar/Czechvar)

I agree. Good stuff.

Staropramen? Isn't that another big one?

[sunvalleylaw]

I like the beer I make, . . .


Actually it's easier for me to say the beer styles I don't like. Obviously I don't much care for American mega stuff, although a Leinies isn't 1/2 bad in a pinch. I also don't really like Bavarian wheat beers. Not a fan of cloves, unfortunately.

I wish I had more time for making beer. Maybe I will find some more time soon. Fall is always a good time for brewing. I have never seen or tasted a Leinies. I will have to see if they have any 'round here.

[just strum]

I would have to go with Shiner's selection - Shiner and Sam Adams.

I am not a drinker and only occasionally do I drink beer - that is where Shiner and I differ.

[Childbride]

I would have to go with Shiner's selection - Shiner and Sam Adams.



[laugh] actually, our last trip to houston brought in another shiner pavlovian drool stimulus... st arnold's ipa... currently only available in tx... and our local grocery store only caries the elissa, of which he has become deeply fond. [to the point of being despondent if there's none in the case]

[Pickngrin]

I like ale. I am weak for Guiness. Sam Adams is pretty good. My new favorite is Tank House Ale, from Toronto.

Ya'll should try this one http://www.ratebeer.com/beer/st-ambroise-oatmeal-stout/839/92057/
St. Ambroise Oatmeal Stout. Wicked!

+2 on the St. Ambroise, Robert! My wife is from Montreal and when we drive up to visit family, I usually take some home with me (St. Ambroise, not family)...

[Pickngrin]

I like the beer I make, although the Oatmeal Stout I made just ran out. I made a Duessedorfer-style Altbier that was to die for. Generally speaking I prefer heavier/more bitter beers and then enjoy them for a good long while. I've always got to mind my Ps and Qs of course, especially since I'm on call 24/7. Sometimes I make a low-gravity beer like a Mild or Ordinary Bitter for all that beery goodness yet with low alcohol.

Rather than favorite beers, my favorite style are:
Duesseldorfer-style Altbier (e.g. Zum Uerige)
IPA (I make one briefly titled "Lion Fan in Packerland Extremely Bitter IPA")
Doppelbock (Paulaner Salvator will be the beer on tap in heaven)
Barleywine/Imperial Stout
Tripel (Chimay White aka Cinq Cents)
Lambics, especially Gueuze or Kriek (Boon Mariage Parfait is wonderful but almost impossible to find anymore)--generally speaking Lambic tends to be the one beer style that even beer geeks don't like. It's not for the faint of palate.
Bohemian Pilsner (Pilsner Urquell or Budvar/Czechvar)

Actually it's easier for me to say the beer styles I don't like. Obviously I don't much care for American mega stuff, although a Leinies isn't 1/2 bad in a pinch. I also don't really like Bavarian wheat beers. Not a fan of cloves, unfortunately.

Oh, nice, good to see other homebrewers here. Didn't know that you brewed, Marnold and Sunvalley. I had been out of the hobby for about 8-9 years and picked it back up this past year. There was a bit of a curve in getting my skills going again, but I've been very pleased with a few of my recent brews. Having a little fridge for my kegs has helped the motivation, too. I love pale ales and IPAs, along with lots of other British styles, but recently did my first low-gravity (well, my first *intentionally* low gravity) bitter. MMMmmm.

[marnold]

I have never seen or tasted a Leinies. I will have to see if they have any 'round here.
It's a relatively large regional brewery out of Chippewa Falls, WI. I believe Miller distributes them, but I'm not sure how far out of the Midwest it gets. It's actual name is Leinenkugel. Here's their website: http://www.leinie.com

[Pickngrin]

I used to drink Leinenkugel on occasion when I lived in Chicago several years back. It is a local favorite there, but nothing I would go out of my way to find.

[Eric]

Generally, I agree for commercial Weizen, though I bet there are some amazing homebrews out there in that style. I tried a Sierra Nevada Weizen (Kellerweiss) a week or two ago, and it was quite good on a hot summer eve!

I think that's the thing: they're not bad if you're really hot. Unfortunately, I usually interpret that as meaning I don't actually care for the taste.

Even the most authentic hefeweizens out there (Weinstephaner, Paulaner) aren't ones I'd choose. Then again, that applies to a lot of other styles (e.g. most belgians, most beers darker than a brown ale) as well.

[Rampant]

I'm glad to see we don't have any Coors Light fans here. If I want to drink warm piss, I can make my own.:messedup:

HaHaHa

I know I'm gonna be in the minority here, but I very like bud :) And at the moment, there is a case of Coors Light keeping my case of bud company in my beer fridge in the garage. Along with the rose wine and rose bubbly, of course :)

I love a cold bud because it's refreshing and I can drink a whole lake of the stuff, whereas with most beer, I find that after 5 or 6 or 8 pints the taste of it just gets too much and turns me off. Don't get me wrong, I like just about any beer. Except wheat beer! My fave german beer has got to be tsingtao, hehehe :agree

I'm also very partial to a Gin and Tonic with a chunk of lime. Yummy. Bombay Sapphire is tasty, no?

Alcohol is one of my best friends. Red wine. Vodka and Coke. Cointreau and ice. Pastis and water. Jaeger bombs. Port. I'm salivating.

[deeaa]

-snip-
Alcohol is one of my best friends. Red wine. Vodka and Coke. Cointreau and ice. Pastis and water. Jaeger bombs. Port. I'm salivating.

Ah, mine too! There shan't be a day without at least a beer :-)

Last night I enjoyed a pint of light local lager, a shot of warm Ballantines whisky and a sip of sweet Heinie cognac to finish it. Yummm!

I usually like beers, cognac, Jaegermeister and good russian vodka, in that order.
But my favorite alcohol is of course free alcohol...as long as it's wet and alcoholic, I'm interested!

...but never drink and drive! At all!

[Trailer Park Casanova]

I like Kirin, but it's getting harder and harder to find.
Even at Japanese restaurants.
And on top all that, it's brewed here in LA.

What's caught fire here in So Cali over the past 4 years, and we've seen more and more of in NYC is Stella:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ab/Stella_Artois_can_and_bottle.png

I still like Michelob on tap.
But talk about hard to find,,,

[deeaa]

Stella Artois is pretty good, yeah, especially locally.

Like Becks and most any beers it however tastes different in bottles bought somewhere else than the originating country. When I was briefly in Belgium I drank a lot of Stella and also Jupiler from the tap and it was great, especially Jupiler...and in Germany I drank a lot of Becks, also draught...but upon returning home they just don't taste the same in bottles sold here.

It is my understanding that most of the 'imported' beers, just like Coca Cola aren't actually imported but made where they are sold, under licences and strict supervision of course, but still made locally, not actually shipped overseas...so now wonder if there are minute details in the tastes.

[markb]

When I was briefly in Belgium I drank a lot of Stella and also Jupiler from the tap and it was great, especially Jupiler...

I can remember when you could get Jupiler from vending machines in Belgian petrol stations. It was usually next to the frites machine, the one with the mayonnaise button :AOK

[Pickngrin]

Stella Artois' marketing exceeds its recipe quality, IMO. It has the cachet of being a Belgian beer, yet there are so many Belgian beers and beer styles with much more character and complexity than Stella. Not knocking it for people that like it, but hopefully Stella leads people to venture into other Belgian beers. In drug czar terms, it could be the "gateway beer".

[sunvalleylaw]

I have had Stella, but I guess don't get it. Maybe I am too used to homebrews and craft beers with more specific gravity. If I am going to drink something that light, I might as well go cheap it seems to me.

[Pickngrin]

I have had Stella, but I guess don't get it. Maybe I am too used to homebrews and craft beers with more specific gravity. If I am going to drink something that light, I might as well go cheap it seems to me.

+1

[Rampant]

[QUOTE=Trailer Park Casanova]
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ab/Stella_Artois_can_and_bottle.png
[QUOTE]

Ahaaa

Nicknamed "wife-beater" here in UK - due to its 5% potency I guess...

[deeaa]

Ahaaa

Nicknamed "wife-beater" here in UK - due to its 5% potency I guess...

What do you mean, are beers in UK usually much milder? I thought all beers are 4,5-7%? I usually drink Karhu which has 4,7 though.

[Barre Fly]

deeaa - lagers that you'll normally find in UK pubs are Carling, Becks, Fosters, Heineken which are all around the 4% mark with Stella and Kronenberg being the more potent 5% and above. Draught beers usually start around 4% and go upwards too (we would generally use the term beer to cover bitters and ales).

We sell a cider called Old Rosie in the pub I work at, which is 8%...we generally have to carry people home when they drink that :D

Bottled or canned lagers and beers tend to be a bit stronger than what we have on draught in the pub. I don't know if the draught beers are regulated on purpose, but we have a real pub culture here - you could come to the pub and drink every night over here without anyone casting aspersions over the amount you drink, pubs are very much accepted social environments. When my friend's girlfriend moved here from Tasmania she couldn't believe how much we went to the pub. People drinking to get trashed really only happens on Friday/Saturday nights.

I recently tried Asahi, a Japanese lager which was delicious. At the moment though, my favourite beer is Fiddler's Elbow which is made by the Hobgoblin Brewery :AOK

[deeaa]

Yeah, UK is very famous for its pubs for sure. Sadly here pubs, like bars in general tend to be more like for getting drunk, although there are places who make an effort to make pubs more like places to spend time, offering table games, trivia games and even books to read. I suppose I too kind of think there would be no reason for me whatsoever to go to a bar/pub other than get drunk or find company of opposite sex.

It seems firmly rooted in people's minds here that pubs are for drinking and for lower social classes. And often they are that too here, especially small pubs in suburbs are notorious in places, mostly unenmployed and ex-cons etc.

I used to be a regular pubgoer when I was living alone and younger, but past few years I've probably visited a pub briefly once or twice per year...very rare for family guys to visit bars I suppose. We mostly drink with friends at homes, cottages, company parties etc...seldom go out to town...no reason to, really. We already got a wife and no need to go out to town, LOL. For similar reasons we never go to movies - I have better picture and sound at home - or eat out in restaurants - it'd simply be too costly and I an basically make better tasting foods myself and without the waits and parking troubles and minding the kids.

Yeah, bars, restaurants, movies and such are for the young people.

Family people go to amusement parks, nature, boating, cottages etc.

Those of my age and go out to bars a lot...well, just last weekend one of my school buddies from grade school knifed another old friend to death in a drunken brawl.

Yep, even though Finland is an extremely safe country, going out in the middle of the night to places where there are plus-30 year olds drinking en masse, or snack food joints past midnight....good places to get knifed or smacked with a beer jug.

I suppose like 90% of all violent crime here is 20-60yr olds knifing each other in drunken fights. Not the best breeding ground for a healthy pub culture...

[Monkus]

wow...in Finland??? who knew?!? I didn't expect that.

[deeaa]

wow...in Finland??? who knew?!? I didn't expect that.

Well, it's perfectly safe for you for instance to go to any city centre bar and party, pass out on the street even, sleep it off in a park and whatever, and chances are nothing will happen. I've done that since I was 15 or so and never had any problems really. There are no muggers or pickpockets etc. to speak of.

But it can get entirely different if you hang around in the city centre snack food joints at around 3-4 in the morning. If you're drunk and jovial, chances are nothing happens even then. Never did for me. But for sure if you stick out as too sober or too strange, something, or happen to be in a mood to act a bit too loudly or whatever, they are good places to pick a fight and even get killed. Mostly it's the winos who do that amongst each other, or some semi-criminal lowlifes though. It's not like its common to get caught in the middle of that if you have at least some sense in you, but sure, I wouldn't go there.

Or walz into a pub downstairs of a cheap apartment block suburb neighborhood, act like you own the place or just stick out somehow well, and it could get dangerous. I wouldn't go to a suburb bar like that after midnight, at least not if I were even remotely sober. You happen there early enough and get properly drunk yourself, chances are you'll be bought drinks and accepted into the lot, drinking happily. Get there like a fish out of water and you might be caught in between some of those drunken fights. I suppose it's equivalent to U.S. in that I wouldn't go to some L.A. gang area corner bar in the middle of the night and stick out like a sore thumb. Just not wise, although even then I'd guess you'd be safe if you really tried to act right etc.

If there is a typical Finnish blood crime, it's some 57-year old wino knifing some 40-year old after a three-day drinkfest at some apartment in a cheap apartment building, thinking they've eyed their woman or something, usually at least some of the people present have also done some time. Sometimes it seems there's something like that happening almost weekly.

But, if you are either drunk and happy or just stick to places common people crowd, I'd venture Finland must be one of the safest places on earth to party.