Blues Jr. vs '68 Champ: Help Me Understand

[Commodore 64]

So while I was testing out the CV50s Tele at GC before I bought it, I was playing it through a Blues Jr. I was playing the BJr. at very low levels (too self-conscious to crank at GC).

Blues Jr. Settings as far as I can remember:

Volume: Dimed
Master Volume: Very Low
Reverb: Prolly around 5 or so
Treble: 8
Mid:7
Bass:5
Fat Switch: Activated

I was noodling around with the solo for Pink FLoyd's Mother because there's a ton of bending and it's not played super fast, so it is somethign I liek to practice to learn how to hear when I'm bending to the right pitch, plus it's awesome. :) Anyways, the amp really sounded so freakin' awesome, especially it was really responsive to the the bending, like it seemed to really accentuate the bending action so I could hear and feel it. It sounded so nice, it gave me butterflies in my stomach (seriously, yeah, I know, I suck, but it actually sounded so cool and it came from my fingers).

So I get the tele home, and I just can't get the same kind of feel on my Champ. My champ has no reverb, of course. But is that all there is to it?

Is the Blues Jr. a Class A/B amp? Does it have push/pull (whatever that means) and does that effect how the amp responds to my playing? Is it the fat switch? Why is it so different?

Does this mean I have to buy a Blues Jr.? Can I get that Fender reverb with a pedal?

Anyone care to offer any opinions or ruminations? Anyone want to trade me a Blues jr. for a nice '68 SF Champ? Just kidding about that last one...I think.

[Tone2TheBone]

...."Does this mean I have to buy a Blues Jr.?.....


Yes. :)

[tunghaichuan]

Your Champ is a Class A, single ended amp. That means that the one 6V6 power tube amplifies the whole signal. Class A is the only way to operate the Champ for audio use.

The Blues Jr. is a class AB, push pull amp. This means that there is a phase inverter tube that splits the preamp signal into two out of phase signals. The two EL84 tubes take turns amplifying the signal. The phase inverter in the Blues Jr. adds some gain as well.

Another difference is that the Champ only has two gain stages in the preamp, which is about as simple as it gets. The Blues Jr. has a higher gain preamp, it looks like three gain stages plus the phase inverter tube. The reverb is op amp (solid state) driven.

Your Champ has an 8" speaker, the Blues has a 12" speaker which is going to sound better.

The easiest way to ad reverb to your Champ is to get a reverb pedal like the Digitech Hardwire RV-7, or the Boss Digital Reverb RV-5. Duhvoodoo man builds a reverb pedal from BYOC as well and it sounds very good.

[duhvoodooman]

The Blues Junior sounds good to begin with, as you heard, and can be readily modified (some of the mods are VERY simple) to sound even better. Bill Machrone (http://billmaudio.com/wp/) runs a business & website that is essentially dedicated to Blues Junior modifications, and I recently ordered a whole bunch of his mod kits to push my Blues Jr. to the next level, tonally speaking. There are always a bunch of them up for bid on eBay, and if you take your time & are careful who you deal with, you can find used examples in excellent condition for around $350.

Re: your question about a good reverb pedal, THIS ONE (http://www.thefret.net/showthread.php?t=13428) delivers springy Fender goodness in spades. $90 for the BYOC kit, $135 assembled & finished from you-know-who.

[Commodore 64]

So you do think that BYOC pedal sounds nice? I have a Fender Stage 1000, which has digital reverb on it, and it's just OK. Nothing like what was on that Blues Jr.

But even if I got that pedal, my Champ still wouldn't have a "Fat Switch" on it. :(

[ZMAN]

I have a Blues Junior special editon in brown tolex with a wheat front. It has the Jensen speaker. I for one would not buy an amp without a reverb, that is just a prerequisite for me. There are some web sites that give you different settings for the BJ, and you can get just about any tone you like from it. It is amazing how by changing a few settings how different the amp can sound.
I think it is probably the best small tube amp out there. You can do some mods to it and for 15 watts it is way bigger tone than that.
I think if you read about them you will find that it is the best selling amp that Fender makes.

[duhvoodooman]

So you do think that BYOC pedal sounds nice? I have a Fender Stage 1000, which has digital reverb on it, and it's just OK. Nothing like what was on that Blues Jr.
I think the BYOC reverb sounds REALLY nice. The Belton module, though digital, produces an amazingly accurate emulation of a spring reverb. It has a permanent place at the end of my pedal chain and I use it with all my amps that don't have onboard reverb--and that's all of them except the Blues Jr. The only reverbs I've heard that sound noticeably better are genuine tube-driven spring reverb tanks.


But even if I got that pedal, my Champ still wouldn't have a "Fat Switch" on it. :(
That "Fat" switch just activates a mid-boost in the Blues Jr. preamp. Get yourself a multi-band EQ pedal and you can do pretty much the same thing with that. If you like that mid-boost, there's no reason you have to go without it just because you're running a Champ.

[guitartango]

The FBJ can sound a little boxy compared to other amps, the quick solution is to put the amp on a stand or buy this (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HOT-ROD-DELUXE-SIZE-CABINET-FOR-FENDER-BLUES-JUNIOR-JR_W0QQitemZ160374735396QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_Defa ultDomain_0?hash=item2557144224)

[Commodore 64]

This is all good info.

At the end of the day, I'll have more in pedals and Champ than I would in a Blues Jr...and still have an 8-inch speaker.

I think the plan, at this point, is to sell off a couple of my guitars for cheap (like the Turser tele and Pacifica), maybe try to sell my Stage 1000 Amp, and then add some cash (if needed) to get myself a Blues Jr. It would be a shame to get rid of my drip-edge Champ, because I do still like it a lot.

As far as external cabs go. I just put together a 14-inch band saw this weekend (my brother in law gave it to me). I now have a pretty full featured wood shop in my garage. (Table saw, jointer, planer, compound miter saw, router table and router, drill press, band saw, belt and disc sander). I do still need a spindle sander, and I'd love to have a drum sander, of course, but those are HUGE monies...But anyways, the next cabinet I use, will be one I make. :)

[duhvoodooman]

The FBJ can sound a little boxy compared to other amps...
A lot of that boxy sound has to do with how the stock tone stack is configured. With the change of just two caps, you can eliminate most of that boxiness. I did this mod early on to my BJr., and it really works. Read about it HERE (http://home.comcast.net./~machrone/bjr/bjtone.htm).

[Tone2TheBone]

I notice that Blues Juniors played loud sound best and you don't even hear boxy. Gotta get that preamp knob past 4 and the master up at least halfway. BillMs mods are great I've got a cool mod and a twin stack mod on mine plus I put in a Vintage 30 clone speaker. Love that little amp. I personally wouldn't want to ruin the character by putting the guts in a bigger cab.

[markb]

I notice that Blues Juniors played loud sound best and you don't even hear boxy. Gotta get that preamp knob past 4 and the master up at least halfway.

The best tone I had from a BJ was preamp at about halfway, master on 12 (two louder!). Plug in tele' and use guitar volume and fingers to control OD.

All I ever did to mine was replace the valves. The factory GTs wer quite noisy. I never liked the reverb much though. Try a bigger silverface or blackface and you might find the BJ's 'verb a bit lacking.

[Commodore 64]

I was at a friend's house this weekend. My friend who plays Delta Blues through a blackface Princeton Reverb. I'm pretty sure the big difference I heard in the bending notes was from the reverb, because I got it with the BFPR, too.

So. Now it becomes a question of just getting a reverb pedal or going down to GC and buying that used Blues Jr. for $320.

[duhvoodooman]

I'd try a good reverb pedal first, since it's a much cheaper alternative and a reverb pedal is so usefull to have. Blues Juniors are very popular, so there are always good used ones available--music stores, Craigslist, eBay, etc.

[Commodore 64]

Yeah, I'm going to get me a Fender FRV-1 here, pretty quick.