Brought home a Black Top today.

[Duffy]

I have my new black Black Top maple board strat at home now. Just picked it up. Set up at the shop.

Will get some nice pictures and share my impressions as I play it more.

I played all the Black Top series and liked this particular strat the best for tone and feel. The tele was my second choice of the bunch. The Jazzmaster was my last choice because it is noisey, even in the bridge humbucker only switch position. I like the Jazzmaster but the noise is something I'm trying to minimize.

One thing I can say about the Black Top strat is that it has a five way switch that uses the inside and outside coils of the two humbuckers in split coil mode when in positions 2 and 4 - and the single coil positions are completely silent and have a great strat tone, relatively speaking. The single coil split positions are lower output than the full humbucking 1, 3, and 5 switch positions, but if you cared you could get a pickup booster pedal or other pedal to increase the output and stomp it when switching to the split coils on the run. Have it set up and balanced out for volume before playing. Or you could just use your volume control on the guitar.

Anyway, all of the pickup switch settings sound great. The full humbucking positions are all noticeably different sounding, as well as the split coil settings. Nothing sounds muddy at all. The humbuckers are "hot" and definitely hit the preamp harder than the average "paf" type humbucker.

I would encourage you to play some Black Tops and see what you think. You might be surprised.

This particular guitar played thru a Hot Rod Deluxe sounds beautiful. I can't wait to try it with my Egnater Tweaker hooked up to the Epi So. Cal. cab. and switch it to super high gain, then switch it to the silent single coil settings.

I'll try to get some pictures asap.

[Katastrophe]

Congrats! :dude

[sunvalleylaw]

Well, congrats again Duffy! Tell me in more detail what you thought of the tele please. Oh, and do they have that strat in a RW board? Did you play one?

[Duffy]

SVL, they do have the BT strat with a RW board but it was not available to play. I played the jag and jazzmaster with RW boards and they sounded great, but the jazzmaster is very noisey, even just the bridge HB - noise must bleed in from the jazz pickup. The middle position on the jazzmaster is also noisey.

The tele is a fantastic guitar. It was a difficult decision but the strat connected with me more, maybe the psychological factor of the black and chrome made it sound better, but I think it compliments my collection very well and the five position switch is very useful and completely quiet in all positions. The tele has a three way switch.

The particular tele I played was candy apple red, a color I'm not really interested in at this point, but the neck was really nice quarter sawn with a beautiful straight grain. The tele sounded super good. Those humbuckers don't just look good they are very articulate and the neck pickup is not even close to even a suggestion of muddiness. They sound clear and clean, very smooth as well.

I have a similar dual HB tele and this influenced my decision to get the strat. But I liked the sound of this particular strat slightly better and the five way switch and of course the tremolo.

You should hear the BT strat. It sounds really beautiful, including the split coil positions. The tele sounds very beautiful as well and is way more awesome looking in person than in the advertizing, stunning really.

As much as I like the tele, another reason I didn't get it is that I just bought a MIM standard tele when I was in Nashville as a souvenir. It does not noise cancel in the middle position with the so called upgraded ceramic pickups. Because of this it is noisy in all positions and it is irritating with higher gain going on, so I am going to put noise cancelling pickups in it - Fender Vintage Noiseless or Seymour Duncan Hot Lead Stack bridge and Rythym Stack neck noiseless but with single coil sound.

You might want to drive down to GC or where ever they sell Fenders by you and check out that BT tele. It would probably be worth the trip even if you don't buy it, just to check one out in person. Seems like there would be a lot of Fender dealers around Idaho with all those cowboy bands going around.

[sunvalleylaw]

Thanks Duffy. There are very few guitar stores in Idaho at all, at least any with any selection. One not too far from Spud, and Guitar Center in Boise. Other than that, most of the stores have closed. I will check that line out when I go to pick up my CV tele when I finish paying for it.

[Katastrophe]

This might be too much trouble to ask, Duffy... BUT, if you have a spare moment, could you pull a pickup and see if those are indeed Duncan Designed? It may say so underneath the pup if the cover is blank.

The curiosity is bugging me, and Guitar Center might not like it if I show up with a screwdriver in hand, asking to see a Blacktop.

[markb]

Aah, found the switching scheme. A bit PRS but with both 'buckers on in the middle. A lot of range here.


Pickup Switching: 5-Position Blade: Position 1. Full Bridge Pickup, Position 2. Two Inside Single Coils, Position 3. Both Full Humbucking Pickups, Position 4. Outer Neck Single Coil, Position 5. Full Neck Pickup

[t_ross33]

The tele is a fantastic guitar... Those humbuckers don't just look good they are very articulate and the neck pickup is not even close to even a suggestion of muddiness. They sound clear and clean, very smooth as well.
My findings as well. I played a BT Tele (Black on Black, rosewood board) thru a HRD at Long & McQuade yesterday. Great guitar at an awesome price point. Gassing for one a little bit, but I currently have Tele territory pretty well covered.

[sunvalleylaw]

A little OT, but T-Ross, what bucker did you use in the tele conversion? I may do one on my CV after I get it. (Oh, your sig line says a Dream 90. What's that?)

[ZMAN]

This might be too much trouble to ask, Duffy... BUT, if you have a spare moment, could you pull a pickup and see if those are indeed Duncan Designed? It may say so underneath the pup if the cover is blank.

The curiosity is bugging me, and Guitar Center might not like it if I show up with a screwdriver in hand, asking to see a Blacktop.

I sent an email to Fender yesterday. I told them they are too vague in there pickup descriptions. In this day and age most want the DC resistance and who made them and what pickup they are emulating, if they are doing so.
I hope to get to the bottom of this. I asked point blank who makes them and what they are. They sent me the receipt email and are supposed to get back to me in 24 to 48 hours. We shall see. I will let you know.

[t_ross33]

A little OT, but T-Ross, what bucker did you use in the tele conversion? I may do one on my CV after I get it. (Oh, your sig line says a Dream 90. What's that?)

Originally was a Duncan Designed humbucker in the neck, replaced it with a GFS Dream 90 single coil. The Duncan Designed stacked humbucking p'up in the bridge was replaced with a GFS Lil Puncher dual-rail humbucker.

Sonically, very similar to the BT Tele, and with the Warmoth neck I'd give the edge to my Squier. If I was looking for a crunchy Tele, the BT would be high on my list :rockya

[MAXIFUNK]

Congrats You Lucky Stiff!!!! Enjoy!!!

[Duffy]

I'm playing my BT strat thru my Egnater Tweaker head into my Epi So. Cal. four by twelve cab now; was plugged into my HRDX.

The sound thru the Tweaker with high gain is really nice. I haven't tried ultra high gain yet. I have not used any of the other settings other than to zone it in on a nice overdriven sound on the Marshall voice, hot, and modern.

[Kazz]

This thread is useless........


Without pictures :-)

[Duffy]

The pictures will look real good, guaranteed.

I wish I was more adept at recording to the forum, I'd put up some sound clips.

I think it's a real good guitar for the price. Wouldn't you know today I got a fifteen per cent off letter from one of the online places. Oh well, this one came from a local store by me and they back up what they sell, plus I didn't have to pay tax, and, more importantly, I got to hand pick it and it meets my requirements real well.

That tele is another awesome guitar that I liked a lot, but I have a Fender FMT HH cherry burst with dual full sized SD HB's of high quality on it and it's a solid mahogany set neck tele.

Maybe today I'll take some pictures of it and my new Epi SG Faded.

[ZMAN]

I finally got fed up with waiting for Fender to send me a reply about the pickups. So I sent an email telling them to forget it I would buy a Gibson.
Lo and behold I get an email saying sorry my first email got put into spam.
So I asked the question again and I will see what happens.
If you mention the competition, it usually gets a rise out of them.

[Duffy]

Pitiful. Pitiful you have to go to such extents to get anything, even a simple answer, out of them.

I just got off the phone with them about a Fender Lace Sensor chrome plated brass covered tele noiseless pickup NOS I just bought. The guy didn't even ask me for a serial number or part number on the pickups or anything - just said they made a bunch of different Fender Lace Sensor tele covered neck pickups.

I asked him if it would work well in combination with the new Fender Vintage Noiseless tele bridge pickup I just ordered and he said yes it should work real well. Nothing quantitative or any specs or anything.

Anyway I am fed up with the "traditional" sound of my new '09 MIM standard tele's noise and I decided to do something, anything, about it, today. I went down to get the noiseless bridge pup and it turned out to be used and the coil wires were badly shredded and hanging like a tuft of hair out of the bobbin. Definitely a multi-shorted out bridge pickup, disqualified.

So I look at two of the same Fender Lace Sensor NOS neck noiseless pickups and pick out the best looking one, for 25 dollars. I figure I can use it on one of my Squier tele's if I don't like it in the long run.

So, it turns out that I know absolutely nothing about the Fender Lace Sensor tele neck noiseless dual field pickup. They gave me the wiring diagram which is very simple. I'm going to install it in my new MIM standard tele in the immediate future, blending into the present.

Do you know anything about the Fender Lace Sensor tele pickups? What did they put them in?

I'm glad I got it. After I solder it in I am hoping to get at least some neck position relief from the intruding noise that the "hot" ceramic tele stock pickups develop. Should be fun to see how it sounds. Maybe then, with a way to jump out of all the noise, I will actually be able to enjoy the noise of the beautiful sounding bridge stock pickup - soon to be replaced with the Fender Vintage Noiseless bridge pickup and then the matching neck one next month.

Call me "modern", but I'm not going to sit by sheepishly and acquiesse to the intrusive noise of the "traditional" sounding pickups on my tele. Great guitar but the noise HAS to go.

Can't wait to play it without all the noise and listen to this Fender Lace Sensor neck pickup. If it sounds great I'll keep it, but it will give me a look at what it's going to sound like quiet.

So until I get that rigged up I'm playing my Squier Deluxe strat with some new pure nickel strings on it - it sounds very noticeably more deep and full and mellow with less overall output with these strings, but it is a great sound. All the switch positions are sounding great thru my HRDX. I'm also playing the new Blacktop black maple board strat with some newly installed D'darrio nines on it thru my Tweaker and Blackheart heads. It's all set up right here next to my bed, along with my laptop. I bet I could use the built in laptop video camera to record me playing some compositions on some of my guitars. The ambience of the amplifiers being all around the laptop might produce some decent recordable sound to accompany the video.

Can I attach this type of video file to thefret.net?

I will also be interested to know who makes the pickups for the blacktops, if they will divulge that info or play stupid or even say they make them themselves. One thing is certain: they sound really great on my BT strat.

[markb]

Just get a YouTube account, Duffy. Then you can embed the vid in the usual way.

[Duffy]

I have a youtube account but don't have any idea how to save the video to it, but if I did save it I could drop it into thefret.net from there.

[stingx]

I FINALLY got to play one in a local GC and I spent over an hour wailing on it. Was a black with maple neck Strat. I enjoyed playing it and it felt and sounded awfully good. I have three Strats already and need another one like I need to grow tits...

[Katastrophe]

Dude, where ya been! Good to see you posting again.

[ZMAN]

Well I fianlly got a response form Jeff Krause at Fender. The Blacktops do have Duncan Desing pickups. The Jazzmasters do not have the covers the others do. The specs are the same.
101n Neck 6.85 A5 magnet.
101B Bridge 12.04 A5 magnets.
So we can safely say they will sound pretty damn good.

[MAXIFUNK]

Well I fianlly got a response form Jeff Krause at Fender. The Blacktops do have Duncan Desing pickups. The Jazzmasters do not have the covers the others do. The specs are the same.
101n Neck 6.85 A5 magnet.
101B Bridge 12.04 A5 magnets.
So we can safely say they will sound pretty damn good.
Zman educate me if you can please what exactly does the A5 mean to me is the a normal magnet size?

[Geraint Jones]

Maxi, I'm guessing it refers to Alnico 5 magnets , you may already have them in your pups.

[Eric]

Zman educate me if you can please what exactly does the A5 mean to me is the a normal magnet size?
That's the type of magnet in a pickup. IIRC, pickup magnets come as alnico (an aluminum, nickel, cobalt alloy), ceramic, and rare earth. Most are ceramic (cheaper, brighter/harsher) and alnico.

Within those types, the various magnet types have different strength. I think the order, from weakest to strongest, goes like this:

ceramic 8
alnico 4
alnico 3
alnico 2
alnico 5
ceramic 5

So when he says A5, he's saying the magnet in the pickup is alnico 5, which is probably the most common magnet to use in a pickup. Each of them have their relative advantages and disadvantages.

If I'm wrong on any of this, please feel free to correct me. Otherwise, I hope that helps.

[ZMAN]

Sorry, I just thought everyone knew that one. Alnico V, or Alnico 5. Some of the CVs have Alnico 3s in them.
You are correct Eric.

[MAXIFUNK]

Sorry, I just thought everyone knew that one. Alnico V, or Alnico 5. Some of the CVs have Alnico 3s in them.
You are correct Eric.
No need to be sorry I was being a little dense and did not correlate Alnico 5 to A5. It was a long day at work I guess. thanks for answer guys.

[Duffy]

It is interesting to know they are AlNiCo 5 humbuckers. They sure sound super good in my Black Top strat with maple fretboard an black body. The glossy black and chrome finish makes it sound that much better.

This strat sounds so good I might get one of the telecasters with a maple fretboard. I have played the candy apple red Blacktop tele with maple board several times, but I think I like the black or grey versions better. Hard to say though because that red one with the beautiful maple neck and fretboard is really really nice looking and sounds great.

The only thing I noticed so far on my strat is the tuners are not really smooth, especially with the string off - you can feel the roughness in them. Some Fender locking tuners would work great and probably drop right in.

There must be a reason why Fender doesn't openly advertize the pickups as Duncan Designed. This is not a bad thing. Duncan Designed pickups sound great in many guitars. Plus they make a lot of different duncan designed pickups, to a lot of differing specifications. Maybe they just contracted out the pickups to Seymour Duncan and requested that the SD markings not be on them.

Anyway, I'm glad they put the Seymour Duncan designed ones on there instead of the ones Fender has designed. Personally I think they sound better and these are standard size humbuckers that can be upgraded without any problem with a huge number of other standard size humbuckers available everywhere.

Mine are staying in because I think they sound very good and do everything I want them to do. The tone is excellent and the sound comes out of the amp with a characteristic special tone that is very satisfying, clean and overdriven.

[ZMAN]

It is interesting to know they are AlNiCo 5 humbuckers. They sure sound super good in my Black Top strat with maple fretboard an black body. The glossy black and chrome finish makes it sound that much better.

This strat sounds so good I might get one of the telecasters with a maple fretboard. I have played the candy apple red Blacktop tele with maple board several times, but I think I like the black or grey versions better. Hard to say though because that red one with the beautiful maple neck and fretboard is really really nice looking and sounds great.

The only thing I noticed so far on my strat is the tuners are not really smooth, especially with the string off - you can feel the roughness in them. Some Fender locking tuners would work great and probably drop right in.

There must be a reason why Fender doesn't openly advertize the pickups as Duncan Designed. This is not a bad thing. Duncan Designed pickups sound great in many guitars. Plus they make a lot of different duncan designed pickups, to a lot of differing specifications. Maybe they just contracted out the pickups to Seymour Duncan and requested that the SD markings not be on them.

Anyway, I'm glad they put the Seymour Duncan designed ones on there instead of the ones Fender has designed. Personally I think they sound better and these are standard size humbuckers that can be upgraded without any problem with a huge number of other standard size humbuckers available everywhere.

Mine are staying in because I think they sound very good and do everything I want them to do. The tone is excellent and the sound comes out of the amp with a characteristic special tone that is very satisfying, clean and overdriven.
When I first emailed them Jeff said they were Asian pickups. That was all he knew. Apparently they are the same pickups across the Black top line, except that the Jazzmaster has open coils. Now the actual pickup specs that he gave me were for a JM101n and B. Those are for the Jazzmaster.
I mentioned that I had asked for the Strat pickups and he said "They are the same specs for all the guitars across the Blacktop line. The Jazzmaster just doesn’t have the cover on it…"
I also mentioned that in today's guitar market the buyers are very aware of pickup types, DC resistance, and where the pickups are made. I think that it would be detrimental to a guitar to have the pickups described as "Asian hot Alnico pickups" . As compared to Duncan Design Alnico 5 101 pickups .
Also it took him a week to find out. He had to email the Ensenada plant for the specs.
Jeff is based in Arizona.
I have three sets of DD pickups in Fender guitars. I have two Deluxes with single coils, and an Esprit with Hbs and they all sound killer. So I think is it a plus. This should quiet the "mod" factor with these guitars because they will sound really good as they are.

[Duffy]

I agree Zman, these pickups sound so good that I think a lot of buyers will be satisfied and leave the original pickups in, unless they have a certain requirement that the stock pups won't fill. I would have a hard time finding better sounding pickups I think. It seems to hang with my top of the line Seymour's.

I'm playing a lot of guitars lately comparing tone, expecially telecasters. I'm sorting out my favorite ones and may sell some of the ones that I don't have need of. I'm cautious about this because of all the stories I've heard from people who are really sorry they sold such and such guitars.

The Blacktops jumped up in price by the way, at some of the big internet places, to 521.21. That is over seventy dollars and I think this will be the way the prices will go on these great guitars very soon. After all, they are less than the MIM standards.

[ZMAN]

I had a price from my local guy at 479 Can. If it goes up I will not buy it. We still don't have any stock here yet so it looks like it is off the list.
I have a ton of HB guitars anyway. At least I know what pickups are in it. LOL

[Duffy]

More info on the Blacktop tele.

I was in the store the other day and a real good player was hitting some great country style licks on a Jim Adkins semi hollow P90 tele, a great tele in its own right.

I pointed out the new Blacktop candy apple red maple board tele on the wall and told him it was new and a lot of people are talking about it. He grabbed it and started hitting it with some heavy country chicken pickin' type playing and it sounded WAY like a traditional tele, believe it or not. Then they say "tone is in your fingers", I believe it. That guy could have played in any country band with that Blacktop tele, and sounded great.

Even though the Blacktop tele isn't a traditional tele, it's an awesome one and not far off the mark of some of the humbucker teles you see.

This is, of course, a different animal from the CV tele's and only a few more dollars. Even though I play a lot of single coils, have my Nashville tele out right now, there is something about that smooth full quiet tone of the humbuckers that has its own enchanting sound.

I would say to definitely check it out at the GC when you go to pay for your CVC. If you prefer the Blacktop, it is only a few more dollars. I'm not sure how that goes, switching up at GC on an order, but if they are making money I don't suppose they would complain at all. On the other hand, that CVC is an awesome double bound looking antique burst tele. A double bound Fender like that is around 1500 plus, or more.

One thing I like about the Blacktop tele is that it has the modern tuners with the securing nut, not the vintage tuners with the press in sleeves on top of the headstock. All the vintage guitars seem to have them push in sleeves instead of securing nuts.

Anyway, in the hands of a real good player, the Blacktop tele sounds like a real nice tele with real good tele tone.

I wouldn't be surprised if the prices on these go up. Some places are already charging over 470. So 449 at GC is still a good price. And I have a fifteen percent off coupon for Woodwinds and WB's, plus free shipping. I could get a Fender for the price of a nice Squier.

[sunvalleylaw]

Good info! I will check it out when I go in.