Giving the single coils a shot

[kiteman]

All three of my guitars are humbuckers with one having a single coil in the middle so I decided to make one all single coils. So a trip to GFS showed this preloaded pick guard:

http://store.guitarfetish.com/ALNICO-Pickup-Pre-Wired-guard-70s-Tuxedo-White-on-Black_p_83.html

Any experience with it? Think it'll look good on this guitar? :)

http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/2781/s5030006.jpg (http://img714.imageshack.us/i/s5030006.jpg/)

[Spudman]

That's a heck of a good price for all that. They have a bunch of new pickups just in that would be more appealing to me though. I think you'll end up with a very 50s Strat sound from the pickups in that pick guard. Hard to go wrong for that price anyway.

[kiteman]

Thanks Spud. :dance

That sounds good to me, them alnicos should bring the 50s vibes.

[otaypanky]

Something you might want to experiment with on your bucker guitars, if you haven't already Kiteman, is wiring them up 50's style with some good pots and caps. You can get a lot more air in the sound, more open, especially with the volume knob down a bit. At 10 you still get that strength and drive of a nice humbucker. One guitar playing buddy of mine told me I'm the only guy he knows who can make a LP sound like a Strat. I don't know about that, but I do know I can definitely get in to some new tone territory with that setup and some twists on the amp dials. Before switching to that setup I liked humbucker guitars but found them too limiting in tones

[Eric]

Something you might want to experiment with on your bucker guitars, if you haven't already Kiteman, is wiring them up 50's style with some good pots and caps. You can get a lot more air in the sound, more open, especially with the volume knob down a bit. At 10 you still get that strength and drive of a nice humbucker. One guitar playing buddy of mine told me I'm the only guy he knows who can make a LP sound like a Strat. I don't know about that, but I do know I can definitely get in to some new tone territory with that setup and some twists on the amp dials. Before switching to that setup I liked humbucker guitars but found them too limiting in tones
Hey OP, what happens wiring-wise with the 50s style as opposed to the normal style?

[Spudman]

Hey OP, what happens wiring-wise with the 50s style as opposed to the normal style?

Ya, I'm curious as well. What does 50s style entail?

[kiteman]

Ya, I'm curious as well. What does 50s style entail?

Yea, me three. :)

Anyway I ordered it. We'll see how it goes.

[otaypanky]

Rolling down on the tone control seems to reduce gain not just take away the treble. It doesn't do that until way down in the numbers. With the volume pot at 5 or 6 and the tone down about the same it gets sweet and not so thick.
The only difference is where you install the caps

http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w49/otaypanky/50sStyleModernw.jpg

[Eric]

Thanks for the info, Otay.

So for someone not so great with wiring diagrams, can you help me out interpreting this? It looks like the caps are now wired...before the volume pots instead of after? Or is it the other way around?

From your description, it would make sense that they would come and pull off some treble before the signal hits the volume pots -- is that right?

[NWBasser]

I wonder if that loaded PG would fit OK on the Carvin Bolt?

Might be some very different sizing specs.

PS - How do you like that bolt Kiteman? And how would you decribe the neck profile?

[kiteman]

I wonder if that loaded PG would fit OK on the Carvin Bolt?

Might be some very different sizing specs.

PS - How do you like that bolt Kiteman? And how would you decribe the neck profile?

The pick guard I have on now is custom made and used a strat template. One hole was off a little. The neck is C shaped and I have the 10" radius fretboard with MJ SS frets. Same on my DC127 but the DC127 have a thicker neck.

The new pickguard is 11 holes like mine and we'll see how they line up.

Love the Bolt. It's well made. :)

[otaypanky]

I must confess my ignorance Eric, how or why it works is a mystery to me. I just know I like it and have wired all my bucker guitars this way. With all the pots turned up to ten you probably won't hear much difference. But if the volume is down 4-6 and the tone pot rolled down about as much, the sound is thinner and more clear than with the modern style wiring. The treble doesn't start to drop out on mine until I roll further down on the tone pot.
Even if I have the volume on 10 and roll off on the tone a bit I can get another nice tone I can't get with modern style

[Eric]

I must confess my ignorance Eric, how or why it works is a mystery to me. I just know I like it and have wired all my bucker guitars this way. With all the pots turned up to ten you probably won't hear much difference. But if the volume is down 4-6 and the tone pot rolled down about as much, the sound is thinner and more clear than with the modern style wiring. The treble doesn't start to drop out on mine until I roll further down on the tone pot.
Even if I have the volume on 10 and roll off on the tone a bit I can get another nice tone I can't get with modern style
No worries. Thanks for the info on it.

[kiteman]

Well there it is. :)

I haven't adjusted the pups yet and just did a once over to make sure everything worked. Sounds like it's gonna be nice but I'll find out when I get around to playing it.

http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/6342/s5030158.jpg (http://img207.imageshack.us/i/s5030158.jpg/)

[tunghaichuan]

Well there it is. :)

I haven't adjusted the pups yet and just did a once over to make sure everything worked. Sounds like it's gonna be nice but I'll find out when I get around to playing it.

http://img207.imageshack.us/img207/6342/s5030158.jpg (http://img207.imageshack.us/i/s5030158.jpg/)

Looks good. I like the black against the walnut.

So that is a standard strat pickguard? And it fits the Bolt guitar?

[Spudman]

That does look warm and cuddly. Very nice. :thumbsup I'm very interested in what you think of the pickups.

[marnold]

I think I'd prefer the controls like the Carvin instead of the standard Strat. The volume pot that close to the bridge would drive me nuts. 'Course, I used to say the same thing about Jackson and I've adjusted to that just fine.

I too am interested in hearing your impressions of the pickups.

[sunvalleylaw]

That sure looks nice! I hope you enjoy it!

[Algonquin]

Looking good! I love position's 2 and 4 of a guitar with this config... enjoy :AOK

[kiteman]

Now my verdict, they suck, these pups that is. No sustain and no volume. When I adjusted them closer to the strings I got them back but sound dirty.

I have no other single coils around to compare but I have two Carvin AP11s I can put in and compare it then. I'll just buy a good set and replace 'em.

It looks good though. :)

[kiteman]

I got 'em at 4/64" and 3/64" before it sounded good enough to play with. Sounds awfully close to the strings aren't they?

I googled for adjustments and didn't find the specs that worked for El Cheapos. :)

[street music]

Kiteman, that doesn't sound just right for some reason, do you think maybe a solder joint is bad or did you try the AP11's to see if it made a difference? THat ax looks great, how is that neck?

[kiteman]

I think they're weak pups, just plain cheap. I don't know if I want to bother trying the AP11s, I know they'll be better. I'd rather get a good set.

The neck is great, the way I like it. 10" radius and MJSS frets. :)

[Commodore 64]

Yeah, this is pretty much how I saw this going. Those inexpensive loaded pickguards from GFS are lowest of low-budget. I will say though, that if you are used to hot ceramics, a vintage wound Alnico can seem low power, but you might find the sound to be a little more articulate. Maybe a little better note separation? You might have to crank the amp a little more too.

[kiteman]

Yeah, this is pretty much how I saw this going. Those inexpensive loaded pickguards from GFS are lowest of low-budget. I will say though, that if you are used to hot ceramics, a vintage wound Alnico can seem low power, but you might find the sound to be a little more articulate. Maybe a little better note separation? You might have to crank the amp a little more too.

I think they're more low powered than I'd like them to be and they're virtually noiseless, even pos 2 & 4 doesn't make them any quieter because there isn't any noise to begin with. I had my amp cranked up that I can hear the hiss from the amp. When I switched to my humbucker guitar it nearly blew me out of the room.

I knew I was getting a cheapo but not this bad. At least I got the wired pick guard with the color scheme I like and the switch and knobs worked good. I'll just get some tex mex pups and be done with.

[wingsdad]

Kiteman, had you considered a coil tapping scheme with the Carvin bridge & neck pups? So you could switch them individually from buckers to singles, adding that dimension of tone options to the Bolt instead of the total makeover? Maybe with push-pull tone pots?

[kiteman]

Kiteman, had you considered a coil tapping scheme with the Carvin bridge & neck pups? So you could switch them individually from buckers to singles, adding that dimension of tone options to the Bolt instead of the total makeover? Maybe with push-pull tone pots?

That's an idea that didn't occur to me. They're C22s so they probably split good. The way I wired it is more like a two humbucker guitar with pos 1-3-5 giving me Bridge/Bridge-Neck/Neck.

Pos 2 and 4 throws in the single coil with the humbucker adding a little brightness and clarity.

I'm making this a single coil guitar as I have two humbucker guitars. :dance

[Commodore 64]

I'll send you a set of ceramics from my '94 MiM Strat. They are fairly hot and nice and chimey. If you feel like tinkering, you can have 'em.

[kiteman]

I'll send you a set of ceramics from my '94 MiM Strat. They are fairly hot and nice and chimey. If you feel like tinkering, you can have 'em.

Appreciate the offer C64 but I want Alnicos and that's what the tex mex pups are so I'll get those. :)

[Spudman]

Plug in a short cord and measure the ohms of each pickup with a meter just to see what they measure. That would be an easy way to see if anything is amiss.

[kiteman]

Plug in a short cord and measure the ohms of each pickup with a meter just to see what they measure. That would be an easy way to see if anything is amiss.

You got it Spud, now will you slap me? :poke

I found the problem. My reading was 1.5 ohms (not Kohms) in all positions from the jack so I pulled the plate off and started poking things with the probes.

From the pups:

1 - 5.82K
2 - 5.24K
3 - 4.72K

From the switch:

1 - 5.82K
2 - 2.77K
3 - 5.24K
4 - 2.49K
5 - 4.72K

So far so good and now from the jack:

1 to 5 on the switch - 1.5

There it is, a short. I cut the ends off the wire and made new ends and got full readings to the jack. Now I'll put back together tomorrow. Whew!

[stingx]

That came out great! :applause

I have ordered the boutique PAFs from GFS in the past and love them. Have not tried the singles but am looking to try one of the prewired guards like you have to get some noiseless in my JV with little hassle.

[Ch0jin]

Good to hear you might have it sorted. I bought a set of NAL9's from GFS ages ago as part of a SSS to HSS conversion I was doing on a Squier Strat. They were so low in output when I wired them up though I ended up ripping them out and using the originals. They are still in a box somewhere around here. The Fat PAF zebra humbucker I got at the same time from GFS was and still is brilliant in that guitar though.

[kiteman]

Well, it's working and the pups sounds crappy. That's it, they have to be POS pups if I were to trust my ears.

[wingsdad]

You're ears ain't lyin'; they've been spoiled by the C22's :) I've played quite a few Carvins...they have (or had...haven't been there in a few years) a retail store about 50 miles from my home. It was prolly worth a shot to try the GFS kit just to verify that you get what you pay for :whatever: Like, if you want a sirloin burger, it ain't gonna happen at White Castle.

Good luck finding the right alnico sc's to make that Bolt your personal 'super strat' kinda alternative to your bucker axes.

[kiteman]

So you think the Tex Mex pups won't cut it? :poke

Anything are going to be better than these anemic pups.

[kiteman]

I did an experiment. I have a loose Carvin AP11 so I taped the ends to the cord and plug in the amp. I held the pup over the strings and it sounds much better especially on the bass side. These cheap pups are bad with bass.

Now that's a 4.3K ceramic pup so I'm thinking just get a good set of ceramic pups and I'll be more satisfied than the alnicos.

[kiteman]

Hot damm! Look what I found, I'm getting a set of these. They're 6.8k pups and they're perfect for my Carvin Bolt.

http://www.carvinguitars.com/products/single.php?product=S60A-4&cid=81

[street music]

Kite how about the follow up report?? Please tell more about the 10" neck versus the 12" your opinion and why the 10" is so much better. I still haven't order that new TLB60 from Carvin and I'm trying to make up my mind as I hate to put that much money out there and have thought about doing the kit when it is available.

[kiteman]

I haven't got the new pups yet because I don't have the funds. Hopefully next month or so. I have a couple sets of pups on CL but no bites yet.

As to the radius of the fretboard it's really a preference thing. I have 10" which is the lowest Carvin offer so my chords will be as comfortable as can be.

Now I have a question, Carvin's offering the TLB60 as a kit? I haven't heard of that one. Time to take a look.

[street music]

KIteman, it is supposed to be coming out in a kit very soon, they just released it last ,month as their tele sounding guitar, I'm G.A.S. bad for it but the price tag is huge.

[kiteman]

Yup, you're right. :)

Man, I can't wait to get those pups. I'm pretty sure I'll get 'em at the beginning of next month. I counted $54.75 from my cup o changes so that'll help a lot. :dance

[Ch0jin]

Yup, you're right. :)
..... I counted $54.75 from my cup o changes so that'll help a lot. :dance

Not a bad mornings busking ;)

[kiteman]

Not a bad mornings busking ;)

Heh, it's really changes I throw in when I empty my pockets. It'll take months to fill it but the last time I cashed in I waited until I had $100 worth of quarters and the total take was $136. :dance

[Ch0jin]

Heh, it's really changes I throw in when I empty my pockets. It'll take months to fill it but the last time I cashed in I waited until I had $100 worth of quarters and the total take was $136. :dance

I hear ya. About 2m away from where I am now is my bucket-o-change which, last time I counted and bagged it and put it back in the bucket, was closer to the $400 mark. I just loath carrying coins. Problem is, that bucket now weighs like 30kg (66lbs) so it's going to be interesting trying to drag it into the bank! God forbid you're the guy behind me in line when that happens ;)

[kiteman]

If I see that pail I'm cutting in front of ya. :poke

[kiteman]

Well, having good luck on CL after I went through my closet and found some music odds and ends to put up. Sold one and another set up for a meeting Thurs. Looking good so I went ahead and ordered the Carvin pups on my debit card.

Can't wait.

[kiteman]

Would you believe it, they're backordered. Now the waiting game starts.

[kiteman]

Finally got the Carvin pups. When I went to desolder the old pups off the switch one of the traces lifted (neck) and broke. I have to get a new switch at the local shop but they were out of them so I bought a super switch in stock.

I tabled the project for now while I research on wiring up a super switch so if y'all got suggestions I'm all ears. :)

Here's the guitar with the PG in place.

http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/4903/s5030182.jpg (http://img717.imageshack.us/i/s5030182.jpg/)

This is the old pup. Don't look like much winding on it.

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/2598/s5030181.jpg (http://img266.imageshack.us/i/s5030181.jpg/)

[Spudman]

Is that a picture of one of those cheap single coils you bought? There does't look like there is even any copper on it.

[kiteman]

Yea, it is, pathetic hey?

[kiteman]

A rockin and a rollin.

Pups sound good.

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/8913/s5030183.jpg (http://img228.imageshack.us/i/s5030183.jpg/)