LP virgin asking how to study up...

[poodlesrule]

I am a total LP virgin, never spent the time to look into them LPs... I feel like a short-order cook who never dared to make pastry!

I happen to have some spare time this Friday, and there is a rather quiet GC on my way.

Best way to proceed.. i.e. what to look at first, best type of amp to use, bring a strap, perhaps?

Potentially, I am looking for either a relative bargain, subject to perhaps trade down the line, or a more expensive but worthwhile "lifetime" keeper (assuming I get the LP bug!).

[Spudman]

LPs are heavy so do bring a strap and look for a light one. If you play one for several hours a night it can become rather fatiguing. Epiphone makes a chambered one, the Ultra I think. Something like that would be nice. Also, the LTD and ESP are LP shaped but have some different features that make them lighter and unique. Also, a PRS single cut should be checked out as well.

[Retro Hound]

Try using a modeling amp (Fender Super Champ XD, Vox VT, etc.), just to get a variety of sounds without moving around too much.

I don't know if you can find some with humbuckers and some with P-90s, but if you can try both.

The Epiphone LP Ultra is chambered and has great resonance. The solid wood is darker sounding from what I understand (don't know personally). I love my Ultra and my guitar playing friends all love it too. It has humbuckers.

[mapka]

Another alternative is the Hagstrom Swede's. It is hard to find them in a GC (although they say they sell them!). Same as the Epi and Gibsons, They come in various build types and hence have slightly different sounds to them. I have a Swede with Tremolo. It was inexpensive, good quality, and the people who have played it are impressed by its sound. It weighs less then my LP classic and has a bit of a more "dark" sound to it. Since I got it I hardly ever play my LP, preferring the Swede.

[stingx]

I used to play with a Swede back in college.

[poodlesrule]

I used to play with a Swede back in college.

stingx, you are not telling us the whole story here...
Did that lead to disappointment?

[Eric]

I would start with as nice of a guitar as you can find at GC, just to understand what the whole idea of a Les Paul. They're good for certain things and certain types of music, just like with any guitar.

I personally find it useful to understand what the cheaper models are trying to do by playing the nice ones first; it gives you a basis of comparison.

Otherwise, the suggestions here seem pretty solid (get it??). I think our very own rylanmartin has good things to say about the LTD EC series, so you might want to try one of those.

[Tig]

I am a total LP virgin...

Then I'd suggest a cherry burst. :poke
:rollover

http://www2.gibson.com/Images/Products/ElectricGuitars/Les-Paul/Gibson/Traditional/Heritage-Cherry-Sunburst/LPTD-LHSCH1-Finish-Shot-jpg.aspx

[poodlesrule]

Then I'd suggest a cherry burst. :poke
:rollover



Alright Tig, I'm gonna send you to your room.... and same thing with stingsx, so that he can think playing with his "Swede" a little more!

[MAXIFUNK]

Well since you'll be at GC ask to see these models and hopefully they'll have them in stock these will give you a very good cross reference of LP style Guitars.

1. http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Gibson-Les-Paul-Standard-Traditional-Pro-Electric-Guitar?sku=581715
Exclusive to GC very nice guitar if you can lay hands on one that not to beat up hanging on the wall to long. also has a 60's profile neck

2. http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Gibson-Les-Paul-Studio-Electric-Guitar?sku=517030
The entry level LP and has the rounded 50's neck

3. http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Epiphone-Les-Paul-Standard-Plus-Top-Electric-Guitar?sku=518341#used
Epiphone version Gibson's Squire but some of the gear is very good.

4. http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/ESP-LTD-EC256-Electric-Guitar?sku=521009
I love this guitar play very well coil split just on heck of sleeper AXE!

5. http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Michael-Kelly-Patriot-Black-Electric-Guitar?sku=513850
If you can find one in house.

6. http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Ibanez-ART320-Electric-Guitar?sku=620740
last but not least nice guitar I just wish it did not have that 50's profile neck but if that does not bother you this is a very good guitar.

[ZMAN]

First of all Tig Very well done. I love that one.
As usual there are many factors to deciding what you want in a Les Paul. End use, type of music type of amp, budget is a major one.
There are lots of options when it come to Les Pauls. I have two Gibson LPS, an Epi Elitist LP Custom, and I recently traded a Les Paul Studio for a DSL100 both 2008 models, but I paid, brand new 1099 for the LP and the DSL was 1799 new. A no brainer for me. I will probably replace the studio though.
My 1996 LP Standard was purchased used in mint condtion and it a sweet, heavy guitar. I love the tone and it has the stock 490/498 pickups. They are by far my farourite pickup combo in a Gibson.
I owned a Chambered Studio with the same pickups. . They are really nice and quite light. They lack all the binding on a standard, but are pretty well the same guitar. I also own a Chambered Classic If I was buying a first time Les Paul, I would be looking at a chambered studio.
I think they are in the 1200 range, with a 250 dollar hard case included. You can go to the faded series. They are satin finish, but they can be a little rough. They do have Burst buckers, but I think the only come with a Gig bag now.
The Standards are the next level but they jump up quite a bit in the dollar department.
Now if you want to go a little lower in price the Epi LPs are pretty good bang for the buck. The Tribute is a really good deal.
You get the bling and binding, a choice of a 50s or 60s neck, A complete set of USA hardware and pickups incluidng 57s and 57 classics,Switch craft switch, Strap locks and just about all you could want . Also comes with a hard shell case. All for 749. The Epi Standard LP will set you back probably 550 and most guys usually change the pickups etc on them. With the tribute they are done.
So You have a couple of choices as far as "real" Les Pauls are concerned. As far as the copies are concerned there are as many out there as you could every imagine, and the vary in quality and price.
For investment and just overall pride of ownership I would look at a Regular Studio, or Tribute. You will not be dissapointed with either of these.

[NWBasser]

Then I'd suggest a cherry burst. :poke
:rollover

http://www2.gibson.com/Images/Products/ElectricGuitars/Les-Paul/Gibson/Traditional/Heritage-Cherry-Sunburst/LPTD-LHSCH1-Finish-Shot-jpg.aspx

Very well played sir!

My perspective is that I have an Epiphone LP Standard and really, really like it a lot. Lots of guitar for the money.
It did take some setup work to get it where I like it though.

[marnold]

Check out the LTD ART300. GC is blowing them out now for $250. Can't beat that with a stick.

[MAXIFUNK]

Check out the LTD ART300. GC is blowing them out now for $250. Can't beat that with a stick.

That would be an Ibanez Art300 :)

[marnold]

That would be an Ibanez Art300 :)

Oh crap, you're right. Sigh. I'm getting old. Thanks for the catch. Check it out, no matter what you call it. Spud threw me off by recommending ESPs. :)

[poodlesrule]

If I was buying a first time Les Paul, I would be looking at a chambered studio
.....
Now if you want to go a little lower in price the Epi LPs are pretty good bang for the buck. The Tribute is a really good deal.

The local GC did not have an Epi tribute for me to look at. (EDIT: is there such a thing...I may have misread ZMAN?)

I did spend some time there with LPs, and some Ibanez. I now see to benefit of chambered bodies..!
The only 'Tribute' that they had was a P90s Gibson.

Ibanez = very light, maybe too much for me?
Gibson = some finish flaws...hmm
Epi = nice, but could not tell much of a difference with Gibson models

[kidsmoke]

Potentially, I am looking for either a relative bargain, subject to perhaps trade down the line, or a more expensive but worthwhile "lifetime" keeper (assuming I get the LP bug!).

If your considering dropping some serious coin on an LP, at least CONSIDER the Heritage H-150. If you're not aware, (which I was not, until very recently) Heritage guitars are built in the very same Kalamazoo plant that Gibson built it's LP in for years, by many of the same luthiers who worked for Gibson. When Gibson moved all operations to Nashville, these guys stayed behind and kept building LP's and 335's with some other model variations as well. Arguably, they are more Gibson than many of the guitars you'd see at a GC.

I recently got a hold of one (a 335 style) and found it better, based on my experience, than my own 335 style guitar, which I had already deemed better than the actual modern Gibson 335's I've been able to play. I've never had my hands on a 60's vintage 335. Folks who have done the same with the LP style have reported similar experiences. YMMV.

I only throw this out there because it sounds as though you're open to the possibility of going for a legit LP. Of course, there is the drawback of finding one to mess around with.

Another LP"ish" guitar to be considered, at a much lower price point is the Washburn Idol, which I often see in GC's on the used rack. Look for a WI-66 model.

Good luck, for sure, this is a case where the hunt can be a blast. Enjoy!

[wingsdad]

Enough info here to give you a good idea of what to look, or get dizzy, or both.

My 2 cents here is based on having owned and worked with 3 very nice Gibson LP Customs in the 70's, and more recently (over the past 15 years), having owned a couple of Epiphone LP Standards, an Ibanez ARC300 (like the current ART300, just another in a long line of temporary Ibanez models) and 2 Washburn Idol WI66 models (one with P90 type pickups)...all of them are dearly departed except for my most recent Washburn Idol WI66 with its stock Seymour Duncans, similar to Tio's, only solid body. I've played a Heritage H-150 and other Heritages.

One critical differerence, IMO, that disqualifies the Ibanez ART300 and the ESP EC Series is that they lack the true LP's 2 vol/2 Tone pot configuration, going with 2 vols and single master tone. They're good guitars, for sure. But these models are not 'Les Pauls'. Sorry, but without that, you just eliminate an important, if not critical, sonic control factor of an LP or any of the myriad of clones by compromising the precision of a 2V/2T setup, and you limit options to modify your wiring with coil tap/coil splits. Also, if you ever consider moving one to switch to a 'better' guitar, your resale value will be hit by the here-today, gone in 2-3 years, replaced by a different marketing spin or oriental contract factory model syndrome.
I second Tio's suggesstions wholeheartedly. If you decide you want a really fine keeper...take a pass on overpaying for the 'prestige' of Gibson's venerable brand name, living today in a shell of suspect quality control and take-a-hike-sucka customer service attitude, and go with the authenticity and genuine customer care of a Heritage.

But if you can find a Washburn Idol WI66, you'll find a guitar with a slim-taper type neck and more than subtle difference in its playability and accessibilty up the neck, near the heel, compared to an LP. And it's not a boat anchor.

[ZMAN]

The local GC did not have an Epi tribute for me to look at. (EDIT: is there such a thing...I may have misread ZMAN?)

I did spend some time there with LPs, and some Ibanez. I now see to benefit of chambered bodies..!
The only 'Tribute' that they had was a P90s Gibson.

Ibanez = very light, maybe too much for me?
Gibson = some finish flaws...hmm
Epi = nice, but could not tell much of a difference with Gibson models
Yes there is such a thing. http://www.epiphone.com/default.asp?ProductID=319&CollectionID=6

I think a couple of guys here have them. Duffy has one for sure, maybe he will chime in.
What I would look for in an Epi is US pickups and a case included. Most guys will change the pickups and you usually have to buy a case with the Epi Standards. The tribute has all of that and more. Upgraded Pots and caps, strap locks, real grovers and a switchcraft toggle. Epis are notorious for toggle failure with their stock units. I have replaced 3.

[bigoldron]

+1 on what Spud said about the PRS. I just got a Tremonti SE and it is SWEET. It not nearly as heavy as a Paul and it has the 2V2T layout like Wings mentioned.

Also +1 on the Washburn Idol WI66 that Wings mentioned. Those are AWESOME guitars too!

[marnold]

One critical differerence, IMO, that disqualifies the Ibanez ART300 and the ESP EC Series is that they lack the true LP's 2 vol/2 Tone pot configuration, going with 2 vols and single master tone. They're good guitars, for sure. But these models are not 'Les Pauls'. Sorry, but without that, you just eliminate an important, if not critical, sonic control factor of an LP or any of the myriad of clones by compromising the precision of a 2V/2T setup, and you limit options to modify your wiring with coil tap/coil splits. Also, if you ever consider moving one to switch to a 'better' guitar, your resale value will be hit by the here-today, gone in 2-3 years, replaced by a different marketing spin or oriental contract factory model syndrome.

Two points here:
1) If the VVTT controls are important, the tone pot could easily be swapped out for a concentric pot. That would still give you two pots that you could use for push-pulls that you can do an awful lot with.
2) True, the Ibanez will not have anything resembling the resale value of a Gibson. Conversely, right now you could buy about five of them for the cost of a low-end Gibson or Heritage.

I suppose it comes down to what you REALLY want and how much you are willing/able to pay for it.

[wingsdad]

Two points here:
1) If the VVTT controls are important, the tone pot could easily be swapped out for a concentric pot. That would still give you two pots that you could use for push-pulls that you can do an awful lot with.
Very good point. That mod could provide a 2T/2V configuration. I hadn't considered that. I'd only replaced the 2 tone pots with push-pulls to do coil taps so either/both pup could be put into single coil mode and 'fake' a P90 or 2.

2) True, the Ibanez will not have anything resembling the resale value of a Gibson. Conversely, right now you could buy about five of them for the cost of a low-end Gibson or Heritage.
True that, but it might only take 3 or 4 Ibz's to score a good pre-owned Heritage H-150 for $800-$1,000 instead of the 5 for a similar Gibson. I was thinking along the lines of if electing to start with one of the $300-$500 variety an Ibz, ESP, Epi, Washburn Idol, etc. as a trial period, then, if the LP Jones has grown to demanding a primo level keeper, not starting high-end and unloading. Either way, like buying a new car, 5 minutes after you walk out the door with a new guitar at any price, your investment's depreciated about 20%-25%.

[Duffy]

Yes. I have an awesome Epiphone LP Tribute to Les Paul, released shortly after his death.

This is a very nice LP and is more that sum of its parts, it is really special and has a vibe to it that none of my other LPs have. Epiphone got more than they planned on out of this one.

It's a great value too.

I would not rule out a nice Agile AL 3000 or AL 3100 solid body from http://www.rondomusic.com/al-3100boundblk.html. This one has the full top and bottom body binding like the Epiphone LP Custom costing 699, but this one is only 399. I have one of these in cherry sunburst and it is an awesome all mahogany LP with a great neck and great stock pickups in my opinion. I'm not changing them. You can't try these out but you can send them back. Most guys advise to get one of the Agile AL 3000 or AL 3100's so that you get the mahogany neck and the better electronics. They have ebony fretboards and are beautiful looking and playing guitars.

I wouldn't worry about the weight personally, I'd just bring along a second light guitar to switch with.

I prefer "all tube" amps. You can get a Bugera 22 watt suitable for gigging for something like 350, or you can get more expensive ones like a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe for up to 699 depending upon if you can find one of the old style ones still in the store - these are 40 watts of LOUD tube amp and sound good. For effects I would just get pedals or a decent multipedal. An all tube amp should sound better and last possibly longer and be maybe more repairable for many years to come, than a digital modeling amp which is super complicated, as you probably already know.

The Agile LP's are an excellent value if you are on a budget, and a real nice guitar by any standards. Definitely very LP like in design and sound.

You can get a very nice Epi Tribute and have a super nice guitar with a great case and Gibson USA fifty seven pickup set but pay twice as much. You can get a cheap Gibson faded worn studio with burstbucker pickups for about the same money, 799. Break the grand line and get the nicer Gibsons or Heritages and so forth.

That Ibanez ART300 on sale, "in store only" at GC for 249 is unbelievable and would make a guitar that would satisfy one whole lot of people, while putting a smile on your face at the same time. I'd try to find one of these quick because they will not be sitting around at that price.

You can spot the ART300's real quick because the tops of the bodies look like they are covered with alligator hide. It is actually maple that is pressed when wet to produce the alligator hide relief that looks so cool. If you can find one of these you will be one lucky dude because they were selling for 399. These are nice and light and have really nice necks as well, if you like that type of thing. They don't really emulate a Gibson LP though and have their similarities and their own unique qualities - all of which are real good in my opinion.

In the end those Agiles probably don't get the credit they deserve, because a lot of people, including me, think they are great guitars at prices that are not commensurate with the quality of the guitar you get. One of the few cases in life where you get more than you pay for. They closely parallel the Gibson archetype, with a slight headstock difference. The fine details are probably considerably different, but you would have to be an expert to be able to identify the specific differences between an Agile and a comparable Gibson unless you had them both sitting right in front of you to do an exact comparison of bindings, etc.

You won't hear very many people expressing disappointment with their Agile LP's, especially if they have the AL 3000 or AL 3100. Under 400 new.

If you really want to spend a lot of money get a Gibson LP Standard or Custom and you should be happy, in my opinion. Of course, there are a lot of other options and opinions out there.

You'll never get to play an Agile before you buy one, but mine fell right into my hand very comfortably.

[otaypanky]

I have a number LP's and the one that gets the most playtime is one of the recently offered 50's Tribute models with P-90's. It was pretty inexpensive as far as Gibsons go. It's a chambered body and together with the P-90's has a really unique voice. They not being produced any longer but they do have some 60's Tributes out now with a little slimmer neck profile.
I hope you find something you like

[kiteman]

Then I'd suggest a cherry burst. :poke
:rollover

http://www2.gibson.com/Images/Products/ElectricGuitars/Les-Paul/Gibson/Traditional/Heritage-Cherry-Sunburst/LPTD-LHSCH1-Finish-Shot-jpg.aspx

That got me. :rollover

but man that's gorgeous.

[poodlesrule]

Update: I stopped at my GAS station on the way back from taking family dog to vet, and tried a used Hagstrom Swede.

I am in trouble. I think. 4 bills, with maybe a little, little room to haggle.

Fretboard material seems to agree with me, but it may just be the novelty? It is hard to be a newbie.

[Duffy]

http://img3.musiciansfriend.com/dbase/pics/products/1/7/1/550171.jpg

I saw a gold top Swede on craigslist today and emailed the guy - asking 400, super mint with plastic still on it.

But later in the day I was picking up some strings and the place had a near mint used PRS SE Singlecut Tremolo for sale for 300, an '09. It played and felt real good, plus it looks just like the one below. I was able to get it for 250 including two sets of strings and a PRS high class gig bag, but a guitar like this deserves a hard case.

I was looking at a MIM tele with a SD hot rail bridge pup but the seller was jacking me around. He's in my personal history now. This Singlecut is a nice guitar with very excellet tone and diversity of sound, despite having only a volume and tone knob. It works real good the way it is.

Thru my Peavey 6505+ 112 combo it produces tones that sing a very sweet song. It also sounded real good thru a Fender Blues Jr III, Hot Rod Deluxe III, and especially nice on the normal channel of a Vox AC15c1. It works good with all kinds of amps.

I'm going to put Grover mini locking tuners on it to go along with the nice tremolo it has and that will be all that I do to this real nice guitar.

My son and a great guitar player friend of his have been telling me to get a PRS SE singlecut. His friend has one. I hadn't found one I really liked the sound of until today. Most of them have non adjustable bridge/stop tailpieces as one unit, which I don't particularly like. This one has adjustable block saddles like a strat and a nicer trem unit, super low action, wide fretboard and is just real nice feeling and easy to play, producing superior tones.

It has a mahogany body and set neck, rosewood board, and flammed maple top. Some people looking for an LP might find this to be a seriously great alternative to consider. The trem doesn't look out of place like on most LP's. It is also, as you can see, very easy on the eye. Craftsmanship is very good, no sharp frets, great simple inlays and finish.

Hope this gives you some ideas to consider. At least another item that might show up used.

I'm not sure how I'd like the man made fretboard material.

[Eric]

Update: I stopped at my GAS station on the way back from taking family dog to vet, and tried a used Hagstrom Swede.

I am in trouble. I think. 4 bills, with maybe a little, little room to haggle.

Fretboard material seems to agree with me, but it may just be the novelty? It is hard to be a newbie.
Seems like you could do much worse than to get one of those; anecdotally, they're supposed to be quite nice.