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Spudman
April 6th, 2011, 08:58 AM
http://consumer.healthday.com/Article.asp?AID=651556

Could Pop Music Be Linked to Depression?
Preliminary study found those who listened to lots of tunes had raised risk
By Alan Mozes

HealthDay Reporter

MONDAY, April 4 (HealthDay News) -- A preliminary study of American kids suggests a connection between listening to pop music and suffering from major depressive disorder.

But, before you pull the battery from your child's MP3 player, know that the study did not establish a cause-and-effect relationship. And there was no clear indication whether kids who were predisposed to depression were more strongly drawn to music or, instead, faced a greater risk for depression as a result of their music exposure.
The finding also didn't nail down exactly what type of music children and adolescents in the study listened to, but rather presumed that time spent listening to music was generally spent listening to the range of pop music currently embraced by the majority of American teens.

That said, linking pop music exposure to what the study authors describe as the leading cause of disability in the world could ultimately reveal mechanisms that might reduce young people's risk for depression, the researchers said.

"Now this is a preliminary finding, and there's nothing about this that says that music is bad," said study author Dr. Brian A. Primack, an assistant professor of medicine and pediatrics at the University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine. "In fact, it may even be therapeutic, in that teens who are already depressed might be seeking a kind of solace or meaning in the kind of music that they listen to. Or it could be the other possibility, that there are certain messages in music that can unmask a predisposition to depression, or even lead teens to become depressed. We just don't know.

"What is clear is that this seems to be a really strong association," Primack added. "So this could be an interesting marker that can help us recognize depression. And it perhaps has implications for parents and health-care providers, in that it could be that noticing that a teen is listening to music constantly could be a sign of depression."
Primack and his associates report their findings in the April issue of the Archives of Pediatrics & Adolescent Medicine.

It's estimated that kids between the ages of 8 and 18 are exposed to 10 hours a day of media in one form or another, the researchers said.

To explore the possible relationship between some forms of media exposure and a risk for depression among children, the research team analyzed data that had been collected between 2003 and 2008 as part of the Child and Adolescent Depression and Anxiety Study conducted at the Western Psychiatric Institute and Clinic in Pittsburgh. The kids' ages ranged from 7 to 17.

Forty-six of the 106 mostly white participants, whose average age was 12.7 years, were experiencing a major depressive disorder episode at the time of study (as determined by an initial psychiatric interview). Of those, nearly three in four also had an anxiety disorder, while the other 60 kids had no prior history of mental illness.
Over the two-month study period, the participants (63 percent of whom were female) were interviewed by phone 12 times on five separate weekends and asked to detail their exposure to any of these five media: TV/movies, music, video games, the Internet, and printed matter (such as books, magazines and/or newspapers).
The study authors determined that age and gender had little bearing on whether or not the children were found to have major depressive disorder.

However, in terms of media exposure, the more they listened to music (via MP3 or CD players), the greater the likelihood of having major depressive disorder.
When the researchers divided media exposure into four levels, ranging from least to most exposure, they found each increasing level of music exposure was associated with an 80 percent increase in depression risk.

In contrast, exposure to print media was linked to a lower risk for depression. With each increasing level of exposure to print media, depression risk dropped by 50 percent.

TV, Internet, and video game exposure was not found to have a statistically significant association with depression risk one way or the other.
The study authors stressed that although the findings seem to confirm previous evidence of music and print's impact on teen depression, more research is needed to further explain the associations.

Michael W. O'Hara, a professor of psychology at the University of Iowa in Iowa City, cautioned that while the study made "some interesting observations," the very nature of this kind of investigation makes it difficult to isolate exactly what's afoot.

"It's very hard to control for outside influences apart from, say, music exposure," he noted. "For example, things like poverty and low socioeconomic status are associated with a risk for depression and lots of other problems, and you would have to factor that in to see how big a role that plays as opposed to simply exposure to various forms of media.

"Of course, we do know that teens and adults who are more active and more socially engaged with others are less likely to have problems with depression," O'Hara added. "So music listening could be one of those activities that encourages teens to pull back from social interaction and dwell instead on their inner life. And, yes, perhaps that could raise a risk for depression."

More information
For more on adolescent depression, visit the U.S. National Institutes of Health.
SOURCES: Brian A. Primack, M.D., Ed.M., M.S., assistant professor, medicine and pediatrics; University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine; Michael W. O'Hara, Ph.D., professor, psychology, University of Iowa, Iowa City; April 2011 Archives of Pediatrics & Adolescent Medicine
Last Updated: April 04, 2011

R_of_G
April 6th, 2011, 10:20 AM
The finding also didn't nail down exactly what type of music children and adolescents in the study listened to, but rather presumed that time spent listening to music was generally spent listening to the range of pop music currently embraced by the majority of American teens.

This part presents a problem for me with the "findings" of this study. It would seem to me that the specific type of music listened to is too important a variable to assume when it would not require that much more effort to gather data for that as well.

I know this is a preliminary finding but I'd contend that until they narrow down specifically what type of music was being listened to, the finding is, at best, faulty. I'm not at all opposed to the idea that pop music can be linked to depression, I know I find the state of pop music to be pretty depressing, but I'm not a fan of scientific studies even implying a relationship between two things when the data doesn't necessarily support one of those things. Had they simply said "music linked to depression" I'd be okay with it.

Nonetheless, an interesting study upon which I'd like to see a lot more research done.

Thanks for posting the link Spud.

marnold
April 6th, 2011, 11:08 AM
Hmm, maybe this means what I long suspected: metal is good for you :)

In all seriousness, metal has always been a serious catharsis for me. If I'm really angry or worked up about something, listening to some metal for awhile will make me feel better and make those negative emotions go away. Sounds counter-intuitive, but it's always worked for me.

Tig
April 6th, 2011, 11:53 AM
Most (not all of it is bad unless you're a cork sniffer) pop music = garbage in, garbage out.
No wonder the end results match what the "artist" put into the music!

When I keep hearing synthesized vocals, it makes me depressed to see these talentless hacks making big bucks when incredibly talented musicians and writer remain relatively unknown.

Eric
April 6th, 2011, 04:17 PM
Most (not all of it is bad unless you're a cork sniffer) pop music = garbage in, garbage out.
No wonder the end results match what the "artist" put into the music!

When I keep hearing synthesized vocals, it makes me depressed to see these talentless hacks making big bucks when incredibly talented musicians and writer remain relatively unknown.
This is part of my issue with people and the bad rap that pop music gets. I would say the majority of what I listen to could be classified as pop. Sure, it's usually guitar-bass-drums pop, but it's still accessible and pop-oriented; I like big hooks and I cannot lie.

I guess I'm just being sensitive, but I'd be surprised if all of the haters never listened to or liked pop music.

sunvalleylaw
April 6th, 2011, 04:58 PM
"All I wanted was a Pepsi!!!"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoF_a0-7xVQ

R_of_G
April 6th, 2011, 06:09 PM
This is part of my issue with people and the bad rap that pop music gets. I would say the majority of what I listen to could be classified as pop. Sure, it's usually guitar-bass-drums pop, but it's still accessible and pop-oriented; I like big hooks and I cannot lie.

I guess I'm just being sensitive, but I'd be surprised if all of the haters never listened to or liked pop music.


+1

I find it difficult to believe that there are those with zero percent pop sensibility and if there are, I pity them. Quite a bit of what I like are things that take some of the appealing elements of pop and deconstruct them to make something new. Even someone as outside as John Zorn has a project like the Dreamers which is essentially 1950's "exotica" pop or 60s surf rock or a combination thereof.

tjcurtin1
April 6th, 2011, 06:52 PM
It's not that music is bad - but 'bad music' is another thing: it is, by definition, bad! So it figures that it would be bad for you to listen to it, and there is plenty of bad music out there that pushes out the good, as has been observed. I know, I know, what is my definition of 'bad' and who made me God... I'll just say that I know bad when I hear it and turn it off. Otherwise the last paragraph of the article holds the key, I think. Many kids isolate themselves from the world because they are never unplugged from a device. They suffer from a lack of human contact and of experiences of the natural world - if that wouldn't make any normal human being depressed I don't know what would - it would be like being in prison.

Childbride
April 6th, 2011, 08:06 PM
"All I wanted was a Pepsi!!!"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoF_a0-7xVQ

Bam!!! Suicidal tendencies. Institutionalized. I loved the dead milkmen, too.

Childbride
April 6th, 2011, 08:19 PM
You'll dance to anything by the communards. You'll dance to anything by book of love. You'll dance to anything by the smiths. You'll dance to anything by depeche mode. You'll dance to anything by pil (btw I like johnny and the sex pistols, just sayin') you'll dance to naked truth...

(lol). I loves me some old schkool. And that goes for the srv, the Janis, the ccr, all of it. Forget the synth, touch the soul. We have some really universally cool soul...

sunvalleylaw
April 6th, 2011, 08:48 PM
Bam!!! Suicidal tendencies. Institutionalized. I loved the dead milkmen, too.


LOL!!!!! I pasted in the wrong link. I fixed it above, and here it is as well. BAM! you got it CB! Based on some recent communications and memories of old posts regarding Violent Femmes and others, you and I would have fun sharing music on a friday afternoon. Shiner and Mrs. SVL could come too. She likes that stuff as well.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoF_a0-7xVQ

I like tunes like the above, I like Nirvana and Cobain's wail, I like loud angry punk, etc. Keeps things honest, says things that need to be said, and rips away denial. But I don't like to live in that music all the time either. The above tune would be good on a Friday afternoon after a stressful week. But I wouldn't likely put it on on Sunday morning.

Plenty of good pop music out there. Then and now. I was a kid that listened to a lot of music. I also agree that it could affect my mood. I actually changed listening habits for a couple few years in high school when i wanted to change some personal habits as well. I went for early Stones and Beatles, jazz, and Earth Wind and Fire, and left behind Pink Floyd and Zeppelin for a while.

So without really researching how they conducted their study, I would think the conclusion is over broad. How can you even define "Pop", and figure out your stats on what the kids in the study are listening too? Sure music can affect mood. But I am not sure how good this study is.

Tig
April 6th, 2011, 08:59 PM
You guys missed my point or intention. I'm not anti-pop, just anti-bad-pop, which by the average top 10 billboard pop listing (not rock, not overall top charts, etc.) pretty much explains itself.
This week's Pop chart, for example:
1. Born This Way
Lady Gaga
2. F**kin' Perfect
P!nk
3. F**k You (Forget You)
Cee Lo Green
4. S&M
Rihanna
5. Tonight (I'm Lovin' You)
Enrique Iglesias Featuring Ludacris & DJ Frank E
6. Hey Baby (Drop It To The Flo...
Pitbull Featuring T-Pain
7. More
Usher
8. E.T.
Katy Perry Featuring Kanye West
9. Grenade
Bruno Mars
10. Blow
Ke$ha

Seriously, guys. If you are listening to any of these and believe this is good quality, long lasting music, then I'm a hater indeed. Otherwise, you get my point about talentless hacks.

sunvalleylaw
April 6th, 2011, 09:03 PM
I didn't think you were anti pop at all Tig. I agree with you on the above list. But I think there is better pop out there that does not for some reason make that list. I am still looking for that good Norwegian pop I found a year or so ago that you can't get in the states to my knowledge yet.

I still question the study. But then again I question most studies. ;-) Occupational hazard.

R_of_G
April 6th, 2011, 09:15 PM
You guys missed my point or intention. I'm not anti-pop, just anti-bad-pop, which by the average top 10 billboard pop listing (not rock, not overall top charts, etc.) pretty much explains itself.
This week's Pop chart, for example:
1. Born This Way
Lady Gaga
2. F**kin' Perfect
P!nk
3. F**k You (Forget You)
Cee Lo Green
4. S&M
Rihanna
5. Tonight (I'm Lovin' You)
Enrique Iglesias Featuring Ludacris & DJ Frank E
6. Hey Baby (Drop It To The Flo...
Pitbull Featuring T-Pain
7. More
Usher
8. E.T.
Katy Perry Featuring Kanye West
9. Grenade
Bruno Mars
10. Blow
Ke$ha

Seriously, guys. If you are listening to any of these and believe this is good quality, long lasting music, then I'm a hater indeed. Otherwise, you get my point about talentless hacks.

I wasn't really referring to you though with my comments as you'd stated previously that not all pop was bad. I was talking about people, and we've all met them, who suggest all pop is inherently bad.

And yes, for the record, those artists are all worthless.

Spudman
April 6th, 2011, 10:54 PM
And yes, for the record, those artists are all worthless.

Au contraire monsieur. Their songs are worthless. It is the pop (bad pop) music that is teh evilz. Not the people.

R_of_G
April 7th, 2011, 06:22 AM
Au contraire monsieur. Their songs are worthless. It is the pop (bad pop) music that is teh evilz. Not the people.

I meant worthless musically. Surely they have some inherent worth as human beings.

kidsmoke
April 7th, 2011, 08:28 AM
As stated repeatedly, the study is very suspect, with no definition of WHAT music is purported to generate a negative reaction. I propose that it is the relentless wall of media that is yielding these results. All of us speak of engaging the music THOUGHTFULLY, even if we hate it. It's a conscious act to say, "Im going to listen now", regardless of what it is.

that's what I believe is lost on todays 12 year olds. It's a constant cacophony of noise, and skills aren't developed in the silent moments to to be thinkers, because there are no silent moments.

When most of us (participants in this forum) were "coming up" you needed to go to the music. You had to choose to turn on your radio, buy a record, seperate yourself from your family and listen. Conscious, with intent, a mood that you sought to match. Now, it is sooooooo prevalent. I just think the minds of these kids want a break, and they can't get one.

Thinking about your ski vids, SVL.....as aware or hip as those kids might be, in the moments that they're careening down a slope, lungs bursting, adrenaline pumping, brain plotting the next move....those kids minds are free. They then, later, may choose to go into a pop music cave, but it's juxtaposed, consciously or not, against what they did that afternoon. They're gonna be healthier for it.

my girlfriend works in an urban elementary school here in Chicago. K-6. They've had students arrested, 3 family members of students have been murdered through gang violence since September. The parents often not even rolling out of bed to get there 8 year olds out the door to school on time. And when the kids are released at the end of the day, they are sent back to homes where there guardians park them in a sea of electronic media, to play video games, watch youtube, surf cable, while stuffing their faces with flamin' hot cheetos and monster. They are to entertain themselves, (not until bedtime, there is no bedtime, just stay in the house), but until it's time to go back to school, often in the same clothes, with no decent food since they left the building the day before. Mondays are the worst, because these children were "safe at home" for 48 hours.

Why would they be depressed? Riiiiight...probably the Cee Lo Green and Jonas Bros. that they've been listening to. Don't even have the patience to give my perspective the accurate presentation, but I think y'all pretty much know where I'm going. It's more and more difficult for "our" kids to unplug, and when they do, what is waiting for them.

Sadly, I think I'm preaching to the choir.

Sorry, rant over.

My anti-depression regimen for my kids.....Hiking in the Whites......no batteries allowed.

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l58/tiokimo/BenintheWhites.jpg

http://i93.photobucket.com/albums/l58/tiokimo/emonlafayette.jpg

sunvalleylaw
April 7th, 2011, 08:36 AM
TK, Nice Pics!!! Beautiful country you are in. About the Freeride team, that is one of the main reasons I formed it. Freeskiing with my race skiing friends helped me make healthier choices as a teen. Freeskiing strong, like racers do when they freeski, is an amazing feeling. Great for confidence. I was on the mountain on the weekend and not worrying about being popular at the kegger after the basketball game. Trying to give that to kids here. Get them out of themselves and unplugged for a few hours. When skiing, you are actually present for a while.

Looking at that top song list, I cannot imagine being constantly plugged in to that world. I feel for the kids that think the best time they can have is hanging at the mall or whatever with their iPod.

Also, when my kids do get a little too sucked in to the Wii or the computer, I notice their mood change for the worse. Our bike trip as a family in Holland (I will do a separate report thread at some point) was a wonderful experience because we were together on bicycles, unplugged, enjoying new sights for several hours a day. Sure music makes a difference, but I don't put too much into this study. Too many other factors.