Study vs. Feel

[NWBasser]

Well, since Steve suggested a new thread for the topic and I'm back from vacation (riding Bend was sweet!) I thought I'd get things rolling.

Both Deea and Eric had some interesting ideas on the topic and I look forward to more of them.

How do you feel about theory study versus playing with feeling?

[FrankenFretter]

Feeling wins ever time. This is from a guy that knows zip about theory, though.

[Commodore 64]

I think it would be cool to be so fluent with the fretboard, that you heard in your head what you wanted to play and your fingers went there.

I'm at the point where I'm thinking about where I have to play so that what I'm playing doesn't sound awful or out of key. Like learning modes and blues boxes. Doesn't leave much room for feeling in my case, unfortunately. I hope that develops as I keep playing. One day I'll look down and realize I'm actually playing.

[Tig]

IMO:

Theory study is important for foundation and framework. Feeling is bridging your feelings/heart/soul to the fingers, and on to the listening ear.

I'm more of a feeling player, but a combination of the two makes for some great music. To me, it really isn't an either/or thing, but a ratio of the two which each person uses for their needs.

:R

[marnold]

I don't think it's an either-or issue, at least not with most people. Few people just have the gift to play musically without really understanding what they are doing. My hero, George Lynch, would certainly fall into that category. 99+% of humanity will not be so blessed. Theory alone won't make you a good guitar player any more than being a math whiz will make you an architect. "Feeling" is such a nebulous term that it means something different to everybody and is therefore not very useful. Unfortunately the argument tends to be that _fill_in_favorite_player_here_ plays with feeling whereas _fill_in_least_favorite_player_here_ does not. I don't think that a theory guy needs to play math rock any more than someone who plays with great feel necessarily has to play the blues.

[NWBasser]

IMO:[B]

To me, it really isn't an either/or thing, but a ratio of the two which each person uses for their needs.

:R

Yeah Doug, the idea of a ratio is kind of where my thinking was going.

I like the idea of using studied theory as a tool toward expressing musicial ideas and feelings.

[Spudman]

Jeff Beck - no theory
Gutherie Govan - theory

Both are pretty damn awesome. Mostly I can listen to players longer that have mostly flown by the seat of their pants. It seems like they are always searching and that makes it interesting for me as a listener. I still love guys that have a lot of theory but they have to be more than just mathematical players to keep me interested and satiated.

I know a little theory but mostly play by ear. Because I play by ear I often connect to sounds rather than just notes. It takes me outside the box. Those are the type of players I connect best with. I would like to know more theory though because all the years of ear training combined with knowledge might turn out some pretty wicked playing.

[Eric]

Interesting topic. I go back and forth on this a lot. It seems to me in guitar circles that people who like to know what they're doing on the guitar are considered robotic nerds, so it's kind of a touchy subject.

I'll just say that for all of the talk of how playing with feeling is the be-all-end-all, you still need to have some basis for what you're playing. Even the non-theorites know something. Everybody has to know some familiar patterns whether it's heavy jazz theory or punk. If someone didn't have any knowledge whatsoever, all playing would sound like random notes.

So when people say to throw out music theory and scales and root notes and what not and just play with feel, it somewhat annoys me because they're assuming you already know the basics. I've struggled with this for a long time, so it's kind of a personal matter for me. I got kind of tired of being yelled at to 'just play' when I didn't know what I was doing.

Ultimately, I guess I'd say a lot (not all) of cool music comes from just playing whatever springs to mind at the time (i.e. playing with feeling). Knowing some theory can help you come up with new ideas and have a wider range of abilities and a stronger musical vocabulary though.

[sjwgguitar]

I think its what you do with what you've learned/how you apply the tools passed on to you. If after learning a new scale, a musician (beginner or not and on any instrument) spends hours trying to improvise, yet never imitating an accomplished player (regardless of fame, someone who can truly bring the spirit of the genre of music he/she is playing to life and make you groove, weep, sway, dance on a sidewalk, scream like a demon, scat like Ela, etc.), this would be an example of study only and no feel.

Feel happens when we can dig deep into the music without having to focus all that much on the technique required to play it - this is true in good improv. and also in reading/playing/memorizing/having memorized a classical piece. In Cameroon, Africa 20 years ago, if someone handed me a drum and said "play", I'd imitate what I heard and groove in the sun. After two minutes, my feel would probably suck/be non-existent, but after a few hours (or maybe days) the technique may become second nature enough for me to divide my attention - one part of me playing and the other part listening...hmmm... or is that technical in nature? On one hand, we're delving into what we're doing, but at the same time there's a listener inside us, observing to help us play in time, to maintain a balance between playing too much and not enough, etc..

Maybe it would be better just to smile and play.

Regarding speed, because many people think refer to "technical" players as those who play a few too many notes, feel is about balance - knowing your place for when to rattle off and when to hold a long tone. It is genre specific too: In a death metal band, its suitable to play 32nd notes for 16 measures, but in a jazz ballad applying the same idea will land you on the sidewalk out the front door of the club. Bill frisell is a wicked example of feel, not to mention tone.

Woops, maybe I should have listed players and recordings instead of rattling on like a death metal guitarist. Music is so hard to convey in words.

Cheers.

http://pages.videotron.com/swguitar

[Tig]

Cheers.

http://pages.videotron.com/swguitar

Nice way of looking at things. And yes, Frisell is a great example.

Welcome to The Fret!

[sjwgguitar]

Thanks for the welcome!