Ok I don't get it (Heart Attacks)

[Tone2TheBone]

http://msn.foxsports.com/cbk/story/7063540?MSNHPHMA

Normally I don't care about these kinds of stories and I'm not a sports fan anyway but when I read the age of this guy I had to check the story.

So the poor guy's "jogging"...he's 56 (that ain't that old)...he's probably jogging because he needs to...and he dies of a heart attack. Unless he was physically fit to begin with and it was a fluke...or a pre-existing condition. What I don't get is that if you are the type of person that needs to jog for your health...and then you do...why should that give you a heart attack? That kinda defeats the reason to even WANT to do it for your health right?

[Tim]

http://msn.foxsports.com/cbk/story/7063540?MSNHPHMA

Normally I don't care about these kinds of stories and I'm not a sports fan anyway but when I read the age of this guy I had to check the story.

So the poor guy's "jogging"...he's 56 (that ain't that old)...he's probably jogging because he needs to...and he dies of a heart attack. Unless he was physically fit to begin with and it was a fluke...or a pre-existing condition. What I don't get is that if you are the type of person that needs to jog for your health...and then you do...why should that give you a heart attack? That kinda defeats the reason to even WANT to do it for your health right?


Well Tone my man ... if he is like the rest of us smucks he most likely had clogged arteries. The heart tried to pump the blood, but the hoses where too small for the quantity. I'm lucky enough to ride my bicycle without having one of those killer heart stoppers. Actually my legs protect the heart by giving out first. Then I have to walk the bike for awhile until the legs allow me to finish the ride back home.

[Tone2TheBone]

Well Tone my man ... if he is like the rest of us smucks he most likely had clogged arteries. The heart tried to pump the blood, but the hoses where too small for the quantity. I'm lucky enough to ride my bicycle without having one of those killer heart stoppers. Actually my legs protect the heart by giving out first. Then I have to walk the bike for awhile until the legs allow me to finish the ride back home.


Ok I can see the logic and physiology in that. Blood pumps but gets clogged. So should you unclog your arteries first BEFORE you do any exercises? What are good ways to unclog your arteries? Watch someone say to run. SEE! How can you make yourself better by running or something if it's going to kill you? How can you circumvent this dilemma?

[t_ross33]

Ok I can see the logic and physiology in that. Blood pumps but gets clogged. So should you unclog your arteries first BEFORE you do any exercises? What are good ways to unclog your arteries? Watch someone say to run. SEE! How can you make yourself better by running or something if it's going to kill you? How can you circumvent this dilemma?

Regular checkups! Lots of contributing factors and risk factors: history of heart disease in the family; smoker; drinker; high colestorol; stress factors...

Exercise is still one major part of the prevention puzzle, along with diet and lifestyle. Your odds are still better. Kinda like wearing a seat belt. Chances are it'll save your butt in a crash, but sometimes even that's not enough.

Hey, when your number's up... :rolleyes:

[t_ross33]

Hate to speak ill of the dead, but this IS kinda funny:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/healthy_eating/article1016437.ece

[WackyT]

You gotta go someday, might as well go out happy.

[Spudman]

So should you unclog your arteries first BEFORE you do any exercises? What are good ways to unclog your arteries?

Soluble fiber my friend. Whole oats, not instant, are a great source of soluble fiber. Ever hear of horses having heart attacks?

I've had oats almost every day for breakfast for the last 23 years. I have no artery problems. I also supplement.

Jim Fixx, the famous marathon runner is a good example of poor diet along with regular exercise. Yes I said poor diet. http://www.halhigdon.com/Articles/Fixx.htm

Jim just ate wrong. It's like the old IBM saying: G.I.G.O. or Garbage In Garbage Out. You have to put the right things into the body in order for it to work correctly. Once you do most of the health problems we hear so much about in the USA don't surface. The body can take good care of itself with moderate exercise and proper nutrition.

:)

[pie_man_25]

/\ amen to that! I'm working out every other day now, the equipment is at my friends which is a half hour jog away so I can get some good cardio beforehand, It's working out great, I already gained five pounds and show some good signs of having killer abs in the next month!

[ted s]

When ever I have my oats my wife yells at me to take the bag off my face.

[Spudman]

When ever I have my oats my wife yells at me to take the bag off my face.

She should just be thankful that you are fertilizing the lawn at the same time.

[guitartist]

Back in january I found out that an old friend of mine whom I had lost contact with and had't seen in a long time had a heart attack and died while jogging.

I didn't know him real well but we were pretty tight for the few months he lived here in Atlanta back in the early nineties, he must've crashed on my couch at least 20 times back then. Like me he was a rock-n-roller (he was a drummer) and an artist, and we hit off real well in that we were a lot alike and shared a lot of the same interests. He was about 5 years younger than me and not in any worse shape than me the last time I had seen him years ago. It shook me up kinda bad finding out he died, totally threw me off my new year's resolution to start exercising more.

Another mutual friend of mine & my deceased buddy told me that my friend had been shot in the chest before I had ever known him...I never knew about that! Dang, it must've been a small caliber gun because he seemed fine to me. Anyway now we are wondering if that had something to do with his heart attack.

So maybe now I will start using that excercise bike after all.

[Fingers]

I used to be able to run around the lake in our park.....as I have got older, I now find that I can only run halfway around then have to turn round and run back home.......................!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g276/fingers23/Smilies/showletter8ug.gif

[Tim]

I used to be able to run around the lake in our park.....as I have got older, I now find that I can only run halfway around then have to turn round and run back home.......................!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g276/fingers23/Smilies/showletter8ug.gif

Did not Robert mentioned something about a half run? Sounds like your a candidate Fingers.

[Spudman]

Just found this little morsel of information. It only applies to those that want to improve their health or stay healthy.;)



Oat vs. Wheat


Here's a fascinating study by Dr. Brenda Davy and colleagues at Colorado State University that examined the NMR lipoprotein differences between a diet enriched in oats and one enriched with wheat. (Davy BM, Davy KP, Ho RC et al. High-fiber oat cereal compared with wheat cereal consumption favorably alters LDL-cholesterol subclass and particle numbers in middle-aged and older men. Am J Clin Nutr 2002; 76:351-358.)

36 sedentary, overweight men (average BMI around 30--obese), aged 50-75 years, were given a diet enriched with either oat bran (as oatmeal and oat bran, providing 5.5 grams of beta-glucan) or wheat (as a hot cereal or Frosted Mini-Wheats), with equivalent calories in each group. All underwent baseline NMR lipoprotein analysis.

Three months later, there were no differences in "anthropometrics" like weight, waist size, or BMI (though there was a trend towards larger waistlines in the wheat group). The NMR lipoprotein analysis was repeated.

Comparison of the lipoprotein changes revealed:

--LDL cholesterol: Down 2.5% with oats, up 8.0% with wheat.

--LDL particle number: Down 5% with oats, up 14.2% with wheat.

--Small LDL: Down 17.3% with oats, up 60.4% with wheat.

--Triglycerides: Down 7.6% with oats, up 22.0% with wheat.

The across-the-board differences between the wheat and oat effects were astounding. In particular, note the extraordinary effect on small LDL particles: wheat triggered a 60% increase.

Similar studies yielding similar results have been conducted elsewhere, including Dr. Ronald Krauss' group at University of California-Berkeley.

Now, this was a study conducted under the somewhat artificial circumstances of a study. But imagine this sort of habitual intake continues, not for just three months, but for years. After all, wheat has expanded and metastasized to all three meals, snacks, every day, 7 days a week in most Americans' diet.

What a wonderfully graphic representation of the undesirable effects of wheat products. When you see Mini-Wheats, Shredded Wheat, whole grain bread, whole wheat bread, whole wheat crackers, Raisin Bran, and the thousands of other wheat-containing products that promise health, run the other way. Grab some oat bran on the way out.
__________________

[just strum]

Ok, I can speak as an expert in one aspect of this thread, I had a heart attack on 8/4/06. My problem is low HDL and I see no mention of that.

So Spud, you obviously prescribe to a regiment of healthy eating, what do you suggest for low HDL? Standard prescription medication has not accomplished much in the way of positive results.

[WackyT]

Raising Your HDL Levels (http://heartdisease.about.com/cs/cholesterol/a/raiseHDL.htm?rd=1)


What measures can be used to increase HDL levels?

Aerobic exercise. Many people don't like to hear it, but regular aerobic exercise (any exercise, such as walking, jogging or bike riding, that raises your heart rate for 20 - 30 minutes at a time) increases the HDL levels.

Lose weight. Obesity results not only in increased LDL cholesterol, but also in reduced HDL cholesterol. If you are overweight, reducing your weight should increase your HDL levels.

Stop smoking. If you smoke, giving up tobacco will result in an increase in HDL levels. (This is the only advantage I can think of that smokers have over non-smokers - it gives them something else to do that will raise their HDL.)

Cut out the trans fatty acids. Trans fatty acids are currently present in many of your favorite prepared foods - anything in which the nutrition label reads "partially hydrogenated vegetable oils" - so eliminating them from the diet is not a trivial task. But trans fatty acids not only increase LDL cholesterol levels, they also reduce HDL cholesterol levels. Removing them from your diet will almost certainly result in a measurable increase in HDL levels. Click here for a quick and easy review of trans fatty acids and the heart.

Alcohol. With apologies to the American Heart Association, which discourages doctors from telling their patients about the advantages of alcohol: one or two drinks per day can significantly increase HDL levels. More than one or two drinks per day, one hastens to add, can lead to substantial health problems including heart failure - and there are individuals who will develop such problems even when limiting their alcohol intake to one or two drinks per day. Click here for a quick and easy review of alcohol and the heart.

Increase the monounsaturated fats in your diet. Monounsaturated fats such as canola oil, avocado oil, or olive oil and in the fats found in peanut butter can increase HDL cholesterol levels without increasing the total cholesterol.

Add soluble fiber to your diet. Soluble fibers are found in oats, fruits, vegetables, and legumes, and result in both a reduction in LDL cholesterol and an increase HDL cholesterol. For best results, at least two servings a day should be used.

[just strum]

WT,

Yep, came across the same site. Started tonight with number 5 and popped the cork off a bottle of wine. Will have to work on the others tomorrow.:rotflmao:

Seriously, I increased my intake of fruits and vegs., I was walking 4 miles a day (much up hill), but admittedly have slacked off. Told my wife about a half hour ago that I have to get back on a daily walk starting tomorrow.

I was lucky and my heart attack caused only minor damage and I refer to it as a warning shot. Before I thought I would live forever, now I figure I will only make it to my 200th birthday.

[Tone2TheBone]

Hole cow JS I hope you're doing better! I've read that a good couple of swigs of a nice Pinot Noir from humid regions is the best bet for your heart. :AOK:

Thanks Spud for adding to this thread and you too Wacky. OATS is where it's at. Whole oats. Soluble fiber is good but without the added sugar component. On my last doctor visit my HDL level was above normal surprisingly however my LDLs are still high. I've been careful of my carbs and fat intake and have been working my *** off on daily "get off your arse and do something" regiment (excercise)...in addition to what I do normally. ;) I've been feasting on avocados and nuts and blueberries so it makes it less of a hassle. :)

[just strum]

Hole cow JS I hope you're doing better! I've read that a good couple of swigs of a nice Pinot Noir from humid regions is the best bet for your heart. :AOK:



Tone,

I'm doing good. I have to work on the HDL and LDL, but that's a struggle many people have. It was a wake up call and on a positive side, it gave me time to focus on the guitar and GAS. I had just started playing guitar about a month or two before the heart attack and the time off allowed a lot of time for practice. It also allowed time for GAS and that was relieved with the purchase of two guitars during the down time.

I may have been one of those statistics where one decides they want to play guitar and then give up two months later.

So on the positive side 1) I'm alive and 2) I stuck with the guitar:D

[Bloozcat]

Just found this little morsel of information. It only applies to those that want to improve their health or stay healthy.;)



Oat vs. Wheat


Here's a fascinating study by Dr. Brenda Davy and colleagues at Colorado State University that examined the NMR lipoprotein differences between a diet enriched in oats and one enriched with wheat. (Davy BM, Davy KP, Ho RC et al. High-fiber oat cereal compared with wheat cereal consumption favorably alters LDL-cholesterol subclass and particle numbers in middle-aged and older men. Am J Clin Nutr 2002; 76:351-358.)

36 sedentary, overweight men (average BMI around 30--obese), aged 50-75 years, were given a diet enriched with either oat bran (as oatmeal and oat bran, providing 5.5 grams of beta-glucan) or wheat (as a hot cereal or Frosted Mini-Wheats), with equivalent calories in each group. All underwent baseline NMR lipoprotein analysis.

Three months later, there were no differences in "anthropometrics" like weight, waist size, or BMI (though there was a trend towards larger waistlines in the wheat group). The NMR lipoprotein analysis was repeated.

Comparison of the lipoprotein changes revealed:

--LDL cholesterol: Down 2.5% with oats, up 8.0% with wheat.

--LDL particle number: Down 5% with oats, up 14.2% with wheat.

--Small LDL: Down 17.3% with oats, up 60.4% with wheat.

--Triglycerides: Down 7.6% with oats, up 22.0% with wheat.

The across-the-board differences between the wheat and oat effects were astounding. In particular, note the extraordinary effect on small LDL particles: wheat triggered a 60% increase.

Similar studies yielding similar results have been conducted elsewhere, including Dr. Ronald Krauss' group at University of California-Berkeley.

Now, this was a study conducted under the somewhat artificial circumstances of a study. But imagine this sort of habitual intake continues, not for just three months, but for years. After all, wheat has expanded and metastasized to all three meals, snacks, every day, 7 days a week in most Americans' diet.

What a wonderfully graphic representation of the undesirable effects of wheat products. When you see Mini-Wheats, Shredded Wheat, whole grain bread, whole wheat bread, whole wheat crackers, Raisin Bran, and the thousands of other wheat-containing products that promise health, run the other way. Grab some oat bran on the way out.
__________________

...And this is why I minimize my wheat consumption and eat my bowl of oatmeal every morning...:D

Being half Italian on my mother's side (the FOOD side), I absolutely love Italian foods, that are mostly wheat based - pasta and pizza in particular. So, cutting back on wheat has been a real challenge for me, but one that has been worth it. That diet change alone has been worth -15 lbs.

As to the jogging for health...

I think if one has been a jogger since they were young, then continuing it into one's 50's shouldn't be a problem (with certain exceptions). Walking has been proven to offer nearly the same health benefits for people over 50, without the cardio vascular strain that jogging often causes. When you consider the level at which a middle aged jogger would be running - which is undoubtedly far below that of a much younger and more fit individual - the risks of jogging far outweight the health benefits for the middle aged.

My wife is an avid walker (insanely dedicated might be more appropriate), and she weighs less now than she did at 25. She used to jog, but gave it up for walking after a foot injury. It's been since she's started walking that she has experienced not only greater weight loss, but a quantifiable reduction in body fat (BMI) as well. She's 2-1/2 dress sizes smaller now than when we we married, and that isn't just about weight, it's fat loss as well. She doesn't eat oats though (despises oatmeal), but she eats little wheat as well.

Bicycle riding is also really great because it's low impact (on the joints), and at a normal, comfortable pace, isn't as stressful to the cardio-pulmonary system as jogging is.

Another interesting little side note. Wheat and dairy products top the list of food alergies according to nutritionalists and holistic doctors. One of the ways that these allergies manifest themselves is in preventing the body from properly metabolizing foods, which often leads to weight retention.

[Tone2TheBone]

Ok so what kind of bread is better then? So whole wheat bread is now bad for you?

[just strum]

Ok so what kind of bread is better then?

Bread that is green and has dead presidents on it - relieves GAS.

[Tone2TheBone]

Bread that is green and has dead presidents on it - relieves GAS.

Ah of course! Bread.....the relative of dough! LMAO

[Bloozcat]

Ok so what kind of bread is better then? So whole wheat bread is now bad for you?

Like so many things, it's not so much that eating wheat is necessarily bad for you in moderate amounts. It's that in the American diet, there's way too much of it. Whole wheat, whole grain, rye, pumpernickle, - all are certainly better than white bread made with bleached white flour.

It's a little like wine. A little with a meal is ok, and maybe a little beneficial. Too much can kill you.

BTW: Green back bread makes lousy sandwiches...:D

[just strum]

BTW: Green back bread makes lousy sandwiches...:D

I agree, especially later in the day when you start to make change:whatever:

[Tone2TheBone]

Like so many things, it's not so much that eating wheat is necessarily bad for you in moderate amounts. It's that in the American diet, there's way too much of it. Whole wheat, whole grain, rye, pumpernickle, - all are certainly better than white bread made with bleached white flour.

It's a little like wine. A little with a meal is ok, and maybe a little beneficial. Too much can kill you.

BTW: Green back bread makes lousy sandwiches...:D


But Green back speakers are the schnitz. :Dude: ;)

[Robert]

I missed this thread. I'm jumping in by mentioning a US top marathoner died in the US olympic marathon trials last weekend. Very sad. Not sure why he died.

Some people are born with heart defects, and sometimes they find this out at an autopsy... kinda too late then, huh?

[Tone2TheBone]

I missed this thread. I'm jumping in by mentioning a US top marathoner died in the US olympic marathon trials last weekend. Very sad. Not sure why he died.

Some people are born with heart defects, and sometimes they find this out at an autopsy... kinda too late then, huh?

That is sad sorry to hear that too. You see Rob that is primarily why I started this thread to begin with. It's ironic that even people who are in good shape can still get heart attacks. But like you said it's usually because of some pre existing condition that isn't seen until it's too late. *gulp* I guess life is a game of chance.