Learning how to sing better

[Robert]

I'd like to learn how to sing better. I have a good ear, I can "sing" harmonies easily, I can find the 3rd, 5th for a harmony, etc - I'd say I have the "musical stuff" down.

What I don't have down is the ability sing well. Here I mean having a controlled, powerful, pleasant voice that could lead a band.

Any tips and resources? Taking voice lessons would be the best I imagine, but do you know of any lesson material on the Net that would help? Maybe there are good DVD's for getting better at singing?

I just sound like a constipated pig when I sing. I'd love to be less of a comedy act when singing... :D

All and any tips appreciated!

[pie_man_25]

I've heard of the zen of screaming, it's mostly screaming stuff, but they cover singing as well, but that's for the newer metal.

[Tim]

I could use some advice on this topic also. I believe I ask in a previous post on how to find the key which one would sing or talk in. As told and agreed, I know one should learn to sing in most keys, bit how do you find "YOUR" key?

Presently I feel I can't even sing around the camp fire. Although I have been told that I do sing well, when I am on key. My problem is I can't go from note to note within a song. :(

[Bloozcat]

I'm hopeless when it comes to singing. As I say to anyone who asks, I'm just the guitar player...;)

[sunvalleylaw]

I like to sing, but still have a hard time doing it and playing at the same time, unless I really know the song down pat. I have sung in four part groups (college) and at other places and agree you need to commit to do it well. Also, trying to support the breath and note from the diaphragm seems to make the note sound better, hold better, and be less hard on the pipes. A lot of the most soulful and popular singers don't do it at all that way though. If I don't, I can be nasal and reedy sounding. As far as ranges and keys, I don't know yet. I would love to have Robert's ability to find naturally the harmonies. I am sure further study of the concepts on my guitar can get me there. :)

[Robert]

Tim and Steve - learn the basics of music theory, and practice ear training. Try http://www.good-ear.com/ for practicing hearing intervals. Great thing to practice. When you've learned to pick out different intervals accurately, figuring out chords and notes from records becomes a piece of cake.

[pie_man_25]

as for sining skills, I have alomost none, I have a fairly deep voice for my age and get picked on quite a bit for it, once I did a presentation on blues, country and rockabilly music in my english class and somebody asked me to sing barry white for them. I still did it because my teacher said it would substitute for my absence of visuals but it still gets annoying being the one guy in his age group that sounds like a man, but I can't help it, I've sounded like that since I was twelve. long story short, I can sing a little bassier to midrange stuff like roger daltrey, jack bruce, john entwistle and david bowey, but sadly cannot sing like geddy :(

[Spudman]

Take yourself out of yourself.

Be someone else, a character, and be it fully. That is the voice you'll use. It doesn't matter if it's not what you expect it to sound like. Just do it. Like Zappa's comic voices.

Expect that you can sing brilliantly and you can. Just stop being critical and stop trying to sing the way you think you should. Invent. Try a Kermit voice and sing "Row Your Boat." With that voice you can do it perfectly and uniquely. Now find your own 'comic" voice so to speak and sing anything. This takes your own expectations from playing in to your invasive ego and just lets you sing.

The reason most of us think that we can't sing is because we are so critical of ourselves. Well, it's hard to be critical of a voice that you don't identify as your own.

Like the Nike ad -"just do it."

[Jimi75]

Hello Robert,

I have spent some time with a very good book, which is unfortunately written in German and by a German author.

What really helped me to get prepared and what sharpened my understanding was the follwing site:

www.voicelesson.com

Check out the free lessons and respect the advices. I improved 100% within a couple of weeks, especially my brething and warming up.

[R_of_G]

I can sing a bit, though my range is significantly smaller than it used to be thanks to years of smoking, but I can sing. My problem is that I can't figure out how to play and sing at the same time. Anybody have advice for how to get past this? It's as if either my voice or my hands stop the instant the other starts doing something.:cool:

[Tone2TheBone]

I'm with R o G on this one too. I'd like to sing and play at the same time also. I can do it with certain songs. Old Beatles songs I can and some Red Hot Chili Peppers songs. Other old school bands songs yeah...but to be able to do it all the time at will would be awesome. That's why I really gotta hand it to Eric Clapton cause he does a good job of it.

[Justaguyin_nc]

I think of Mayberry when I sing.. I can go from Barney Fife to almost Jim Nabors.. I said almost.. and I mean during the same song...sigh..

and try to strum and sing too.. it's like chewing gum while I walk..I always trip.. to many things at one time.

[t_ross33]

I really envy people who can sing harmonies with little effort. I can pick up melodies no problem - and I can sing reasonably well even when playing guitar. Backup vocals and harmonies are really tough for me - working on it though and getting better with more practice and live application.

I also have trouble singing and playing bass at the same time. Guitar, no biggie, but my brain gridlocks when I'm playing bass - ha ha! We do a couple tunes where I play bass and sing backups and I'm getting better but it sure takes work.

As far as learning to sing better, I'm self taught (very apparent to any who've heard me :p ) and have always wanted to take some lessons - just never made the time. I even thought about joining our church choir or local jazz/pop vocal chorus.

Then I got this guitar gig and...

;)

P.S. Beer only makes you sound better in your own head. I've learned that from experience.

[pes_laul]

right now i can sing fairly ok im better at backing but where i learned was cranking up the stereo real loud and singing to that though im still afraid to sing at the talent show :(

[Brian Krashpad]

Take yourself out of yourself.

Be someone else, a character, and be it fully. That is the voice you'll use. It doesn't matter if it's not what you expect it to sound like. Just do it. Like Zappa's comic voices.

Expect that you can sing brilliantly and you can. Just stop being critical and stop trying to sing the way you think you should. Invent. Try a Kermit voice and sing "Row Your Boat." With that voice you can do it perfectly and uniquely. Now find your own 'comic" voice so to speak and sing anything. This takes your own expectations from playing in to your invasive ego and just lets you sing.

The reason most of us think that we can't sing is because we are so critical of ourselves. Well, it's hard to be critical of a voice that you don't identify as your own.

Like the Nike ad -"just do it."

I like this. I haven't seen it put this way but I think it's helpful.

The way I think of the process is "finding" your voice/vocal style. It is out there and the more you experiment in different singing styles and vocals, the closer you will get to finding it.

I am by no means great shakes as a singer. I have tons of limitations. BUT at this point I do think I have found my voice and how it sounds best. One of my great adavantages is that, in my main band (the only one where I sing lead) I write songs in a backwards process to that of many guitarists, who most often noodle about on guitar and then try to find some melody and lyrics to stick into a guitar structure.

Instead, I write songs "internally"-- in my head, and then sung a capella to complete the writing process and get all the lyrics finished. All this is done before picking up an instrument. By writing in this fashion, I have to figure out how to play on the guitar what I already know I can sing, instead of seeing whether I can actually sing something already written on guitar.

It may be helpful for learning stage singing to approach original material in that fashion.

The simplest big thing I learned was getting past shyness/fear. You will never sound your best or find your voice unless you sing out. Sure it may be painful, but put that aside and go for it. Like anything else, the more you do the better you become.

I wish I had an ear for harmony like Robert.

[Brian Krashpad]

I also have trouble singing and playing bass at the same time. Guitar, no biggie, but my brain gridlocks when I'm playing bass - ha ha! We do a couple tunes where I play bass and sing backups and I'm getting better but it sure takes work.

I think that's pretty common, playing bass and singing is a lot tougher for me, and I think for most folks, than singing while playing guitar. I tend to write really simple bass lines and keep my fills and runs to the spaces between the vocal lines. This to me has two advantages. First, I think it simply sounds better in the overall mix because you don't have some busy bass line competing with the vocal.

And second-- it makes it easier for me to sing and play bass! :D

https://gnn.ufalumni.ufl.edu/visuals/florida/albums/54781/IMG_1OOC2Pk6.JPG

[Robert]

Thanks guys, and thanks Brian and Spud. I think you guys are right. You just gotta DO it! I sure don't DO it right now, so there's no way I'm gonna get better at it at this rate... ;)

[Tone2TheBone]

Robert - It would be interesting to find out if you can sing without your accent. heh

[jpfeifer]

Hi Robert,

My wife was actually a vocal major in college and she teaches singing as a sideline.

I'm not that good of a singer but I'm getting more confident with the types of things I can do, which is very limited.

When it comes to singing I think that there are some basics that a vocal teacher would concentrate on such as proper breathing, the right way to pronounce vowels, etc. The breath control part is mostly about learning how to use your diaphram to breathe deeply and put enough air behind your notes, giving you more volume and nicer tone.

I do think that most people don't like their own voice (myself included). I'd read some interviews with George Martin who said that John Lennon hated his own singning voice, but I thought John Lennon's voice was great.

I think that everyone's voice has unique qualities. It's like an instrument. You need to take some time to get to know what it's capable of and how it likes to be played. Part of the process should be to find out what your best qualities are and emphasize songs with those qualities. Also, try to find out where your sweet spot is. Try singing in different ranges to know how far your instrument will go and which range feels the most natural. Some people have a naturally good upper range that breaks up like a good amp does when pushed hard (try singing loud in your upper range and see how the tone works) Try "Twist and Shout" or songs like that. Other people have a good breathy kind of sound like John Mayer (try singing some songs with a breathy sound and see how it works for you). Other people have a naturally good falsetto and they can go smoothly in and out of it without noticing it. Elton John had this kind of quality.

The key is to find your sound, discover what works for you unique voice, then work on it to get the most out of it. Your voice is a muscle so it can be worked out and excercised. The more you sing the better you will sound.

-- Jim

[Robert]

Thanks for tips, Jim! Appreciated!

I like to sing in the car (when I'm driving alone) for practice. I think I sound good in the car! But only in the car - not anywhere else. :D

[Spudman]

Thanks for tips, Jim! Appreciated!

I like to sing in the car (when I'm driving alone) for practice. I think I sound good in the car! But only in the car - not anywhere else. :D

Record yourself singing in the car and then you will know exactly what you sound like, and that can be a step toward getting to the level of competence that you desire.

[jpfeifer]

Yeah, I like to sing in the car too. It's the only place where I can experiment and not feel bad if it sounds like crap.

I agree with Spudman. Record your own voice on a song that you like. You don't have to play it for anyone but yourself, but you can get a view into what you sound like. The other thing that you might try is recording your voice on a song and double it. Record two separate tracks of your voice doing the same part then pan them hard Left and Right. You would be surprised how good your voice will sound. It will also help you to hear some qualities to your voice that you might not be aware of. Listen to any Paul Simon records and you will hear them using this technique alot. They also did this alot for many of the Beatle recordings to make the lead vocals sound a little fatter.

One of my friends wanted to make a recording for his wife as a Birthday present. He is not a serious singer and his voice was a little weak, but we recorded his voice in this doubled tracked stereo method and it sounded amazing. I was surprised at how good he sounded. His wife was very pleased.

-- Jim

[Brian Krashpad]

Singing in the car is a good thing. I do it all the time.

Hopefully you'll get a lot better than I!

Singing in a live sitch with a band or otherwise in performance (even if only at a practice or private party or what have you) is especially good too, same as for guitar. For whatever reason the interaction of the vocalist with the other players (not to mention the possible, hopefully objective, feedback from the others) seems to often take things to another level not attainable when just practising by oneself. It also provides additional challenges such as proper microphone technique and learning to translate hearing oneself internally into realizing what one sounds like to others if there are problems with not being able to hear oneself in the PA over the accompaniment. While these things could be considered negatives, I'm firmly of the belief that what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. And overcoming those problems is something you will have to deal with later if you are looking to perform vocally live anyhow.

A couple weeks ago I played in an un-air-conditioned concert hall where the onstage heat index was no doubt in excess of 100 F, with no vocal monitors, and a full 4-piece band backing. Sooner or later, most live performers are going to have to face some kind of adverse performance sitch, so the closer you can practice to actual stage circumstances the better off you'll be when the caca hits the fan.