Any Hot Rod Deluxe fans on this forum?

[kipper]

I have owned a HRD amp for a little while now and I really like it. However, I cannot help but notice there seem to be a fair few people around who seem to dislike this amp intensely but - at least in many cases - do not explain why! Yes, the OD channel sucks but surely most people buying a Fender amp are not expecting a great OD sound. Do what I did and add pedals to the clean channel!

For the money I think this is a really great amp, apparently it's the biggest selling tube amp of all time so despite what some might think of it, obviously Fender is doing something right here. I compared it to a Fender Blues Junior and the HRD won hands down.

The HRD is my second amp - having dabbled with a Vox modelling amp previously - but I had serious problems with it. The HRD seems to have plenty of haters, who say it's unreliable but I've had the HRD for several months now with no problems at all and I've read that some people have been using them and abusing them completely trouble-free for years. I can't say the same about the Vox Valvetronix unfortunately and the reliability of those (or lack of it) is a real issue for me.

As I only play at home only, I also invested in a Dr Z Air Brake attenuator. I would highly recommend this particular attenuator if you need to tame the HRD's volume.

I've not been playing much more than a year and am very happy with this setup, which includes my MIA Strat and a Boss ME-50. I only use the clean channel on the HRD and use the Boss to get OD sounds.

So far I've made no modifications to the amp, I don't really see the need to. The amp sounds good enough as it comes from the factory, to my ears anyway. If I did change anything, I'd probably change the speaker to a Celestion.

I say HRD owners of the world unite against the naysayers! I'm fairly new to guitar (I used to play keyboards years ago, for my sins) and I've been thoroughly enjoying the HRD. It definitely gets a big thumbs up from me.

:AOK:

[mrmudcat]

I have a limited edition green hot rod with a vin-30 and some nice jj tubes....I love mine but then again I dont play death metal through it:master:

[TS808]

I don't know why the Fender Hot Rod series amps get trashed either...I used to own the Hot Rod Deville 212 years ago, and thought it was a solid amp..good cleans, excellent reverb, and I didn't think the overdrive channel was bad at all. The only gripe I ever had about the Deville was the volume knob and how it jumps from 0 to about 4....hard to tame the volume on those below 4.

[kipper]

I have a limited edition green hot rod with a vin-30 and some nice jj tubes....I love mine but then again I dont play death metal through it:master:

Is that the surf green one? Nice! :AOK:

[kipper]

I don't know why the Fender Hot Rod series amps get trashed either...I used to own the Hot Rod Deville 212 years ago, and thought it was a solid amp..good cleans, excellent reverb, and I didn't think the overdrive channel was bad at all. The only gripe I ever had about the Deville was the volume knob and how it jumps from 0 to about 4....hard to tame the volume on those below 4.

On the HRD the amp volume increase on the clean channel is even more extreme. 1 is too quiet, 1.5 is too loud. Hence why I need the Dr Z Air Brake. I asked one of the Fender guys at the recent London International Music Show why they designed it that way but didn't get a sensible answer!

[markb]

Fender put in a linear taper pot. It makes the HR amps sound louder than the competition in the shop. "Wow, if it's this loud on 2...". Replacing the pot with an audio (log) taper one will fix this problem but will invalidate the warranty.

Here's more info than you probably need to know about the HRD.

http://studentweb.eku.edu/justin_holton/

FWIW, I think they're just fine apart from the twitchy volume control and the OD channel.

[oldguy]

I've never owned a HRD, but I've heard lots of guitar players use them in local bars/clubs over the years, and they sound great in the hands of a good picker IMO.
Some of the best blues I've heard locally were through a cranked HRD, just on the edge of gritty distortion and pushed over the edge w/ the guitar's volume control........just great sounding. :beer:

[kipper]

Good to see there's some positive opinions on the HRD here...keep 'em coming. Justin Holton's site is very useful indeed, that's the first web site I found when I googled "Hot Rod Deluxe" not long after I got home and realised I'd better get the volume problem sorted pretty quick!

[Rabies]

....having dabbled with a Vox modelling amp previously - but I had serious problems with it. The HRD seems to have plenty of haters, who say it's unreliable but I've had the HRD for several months now with no problems at all and I've read that some people have been using them and abusing them completely trouble-free for years. I can't say the same about the Vox Valvetronix unfortunately and the reliability of those (or lack of it) is a real issue for me....

I say HRD owners of the world unite against the naysayers! I'm fairly new to guitar (I used to play keyboards years ago, for my sins) and I've been thoroughly enjoying the HRD. It definitely gets a big thumbs up from me.

:AOK:

Watch out...you could get flamed for MUCH LESS around here...:thwap: :whatever:

[Spudman]

I've got an HRDX too. No problems here.

I quit taking it to gigs but that is mainly what it is for. I just turn it up and go...then I get told to turn down.:D
It has a wonderful clean channel and plenty of headroom to stay clean with a loud drummer. I too only use the clean channel with pedals in front for dirt.

Lately I've taken to using a 30 watt amph instead of the HRDX just because I can get breakup a little earlier in the pain scale.

Anyway, I'm keeping mine. It's a good amp.

[Rocket]

I haven't owned a HRD'X but I've used several. No probs... it does what it's supposed to do. I do currently own a HRD'V212 that replaced a HRD'V410. I work it to death... also no probs. Highly recommend.

Marshall amplifies... Fender AMPS!

[ZMAN]

I have the Blues Deluxe Reissue in the tweed. I was really excited about getting a tweed amp and I should have listened to my guitar tech. He said I should look at the 65 Deluxe reverb. I only play at home and the 22 watts would be perfect. I also have a Special Edition Blues Junior with the Jensen Speaker. I eventually bought the 65 after I found the 40 watt Blues Deluxe Reissue to be pretty loud. I do like the amp and it does not have a lot of gain but it has the effects loop and I have a complete pedal board full of Fulltone pedals so I can get most any sounds I want from them. I am toying with the idea of selling the Blues Deluxe and putting the money towards a Gibson LP standard down the road. But I do like the looks and sound of the amp. But the 65 Deluxe is pure sweetness and I never plug into the Blues Deluxe any more.

[ShortBuSX]

I cannot help but notice there seem to be a fair few people around who seem to dislike this amp intensely but - at least in many cases - do not explain why! Yes, the OD channel sucks but surely most people buying a Fender amp are not expecting a great OD sound. Do what I did and add pedals to the clean channel!

I just bought a used Deville, so Ive been reading up on it throughout the forums for over a month...I find that some forums hate on the HotRod series moreso than other forums. The impression I get is that most of the haters are "moders" whos mods have failed them or caused them to damage their boards.
The ACTUAL posted problems are few and far inbetween, and appear to be easy to fix.
If you frequent other forums though youll find many many satisfied customers, Im particularrly fond of the FDP forum, they have a HRD tavern (http://www.fenderforum.com/forum.html?db=&topic_number=312232) that goes back as far as 2003, so theres plenty to read with very few haters, and even includes good informative posts from "Justin" as well as others who contributed to the "Unofficial Hotrod" pages.


As I only play at home only, I also invested in a Dr Z Air Brake attenuator. I would highly recommend this particular attenuator if you need to tame the HRD's volume.

I think youll be pleasantly surprised what replacing the preamp tubes will do for you...but Im also looking at getting a Weber Mass in the future(or a volume box as a cheap alternative)


I've not been playing much more than a year and am very happy with this setup, which includes my MIA Strat and a Boss ME-50. I only use the clean channel on the HRD and use the Boss to get OD sounds.

After changing my preamp tubes(BTW they dont require biasing) my drive channels have become more useful and pleasant...Im really having a hard time finding a need/use for my OD or distortion since. Seriously.
But then again youve had yours for awhile.

[kipper]

Watch out...you could get flamed for MUCH LESS around here...:thwap: :whatever:

Really? Flamed for saying I like the Hot Rod Deluxe or for saying I ditched the Vox Valvetronix due to reliability concerns? Or both? :confused:

Well I'll stand by my view that the Fender HRD is - IMHO - a very good amp for the money. And I'll also say that I really do like the Valvetronix modelling technology. I do think it's great...I just wish Vox would not put it in those unreliable QC-lacking chrome VT series amps!

[kipper]

...Im also looking at getting a Weber Mass in the future(or a volume box as a cheap alternative)

I would strongly recommend the Dr Z Air Brake, I really would. It will work with any amp load (4,8,16 ohm) and any amp with a power rating of 100w or less. I read many, many reviews of most if not all the attenuators on the market before I took the plunge and I'm glad I made the investment in it.

The Webers cannot easily be found over here in the UK, so that was another important factor for me. YMMV of course.

The Dr Z Air Brake is very transparent and is simple to connect as well, with the right cables (which I had custom made).

I tried the volume box approach to start with and sure enough it works, but of course it's not working the tubes at all because it's in the preamp stage.

It made a big difference in terms of controlling the volume down to sensible levels, basically acting as a MV for the clean channel, but it added a lot of not-too-pleasant preamp mush to my ears. Even clean patches on my Boss ME-50 started to sound distorted and mushy.

When I got the Air Brake and hooked it up I could not believe the difference between the sound I was now hearing and the sound I had been getting with the volume box. Talk about night and day.

I would seriously urge you to consider getting an attenuator instead of the volume box, you won't regret it :)

[ShortBuSX]

Youve damn near sold me on the Dr.Z Airbrake...but its $329!?!?:thwap:
And here I was balking at the Weber's $160-$225(Mass Lite or Mass) price tag...for some reason I still want a Blues Jr, so Id rather that kinda money go towards that instead. But if I can get a deal on an attenuator first(like Ebay) Im sure I'll jump on it.
But Im able to get pretty decent bedroom level out of my Deville right now, but if I lived in an apartment again Im sure the neighbors would have issue with the bottom end comin out of this thing(although Im luvin it!).

Ive got more preamp tubes on the way, 2) Jan 5751's and a balanced Jan 12AT7(for the inverter)...and Ive already got a couple JJ 12AX7 and a couple JJ 12AT7 and one balanced EH 12AY7(for the inverter again). Im having fun mixing and switching these around to shape the tone I want, Im getting close...I put all 12AX7 back in all the slots last night to kinda look back to see where I came from, and Ive got to say, I dont miss the boom-iness and intense loudness of that set up and feel this is money well spent, and being used from 1996 with the OEM Fender tubes still in her, it really needed it...but Id still highly recommend a tube change for so many tonal reasons.:rockon:

PS, thanks for the heads up on the volume box, Ive been getting that impression from other posters throughout the WWW...you just reinforced it a lil further, thanks again!

[Lev]

HRDx rock!! :rockon:

Yep the drive and more drive channels are kinda harsh but stick a $30 Bad Monkey on the clean channel and hey presto!!!

THey seem to work great with modellers too both in front of th amp and in the FX loop.

If you have a great clean channel you can always get good drive with the right pedal but if you aint got a good clean tone in the first place noting will sound good!

[kipper]

Youve damn near sold me on the Dr.Z Airbrake...but its $329!?!?:thwap:
And here I was balking at the Weber's $160-$225(Mass Lite or Mass) price tag...for some reason I still want a Blues Jr, so Id rather that kinda money go towards that instead. But if I can get a deal on an attenuator first(like Ebay) Im sure I'll jump on it.
But Im able to get pretty decent bedroom level out of my Deville right now, but if I lived in an apartment again Im sure the neighbors would have issue with the bottom end comin out of this thing(although Im luvin it!).

Ive got more preamp tubes on the way, 2) Jan 5751's and a balanced Jan 12AT7(for the inverter)...and Ive already got a couple JJ 12AX7 and a couple JJ 12AT7 and one balanced EH 12AY7(for the inverter again). Im having fun mixing and switching these around to shape the tone I want, Im getting close...I put all 12AX7 back in all the slots last night to kinda look back to see where I came from, and Ive got to say, I dont miss the boom-iness and intense loudness of that set up and feel this is money well spent, and being used from 1996 with the OEM Fender tubes still in her, it really needed it...but Id still highly recommend a tube change for so many tonal reasons.:rockon:

PS, thanks for the heads up on the volume box, Ive been getting that impression from other posters throughout the WWW...you just reinforced it a lil further, thanks again!

Yeah, the Air Brake isn't cheap but well worth it in my opinion...and over here is cost me £220 (that's around $440 at current exchange rates) so $329 isn't so bad IMHO. I can honestly say it was money very well spent.

I live in a detached house, which helps, and I can play at sensible volumes with the tone and character of the HRDx pretty much intact. The Air Brake does not suck the tone out. It squashes the top end a little bit (easily fixed by adding more treble in the EQ amp) and the bottom end sounds great.

The volume box is certainly worth a try, I guess it depends on your tastes. If you like preamp distortion it's great but if you want a more natural sound the Air Brake would be the way to go IMHO.

Sounds like you've been trying out lots of mods with the tubes on your HRDx. I'll leave them as they are for the time being...as and when they need replacing I may consider alternatives.

Good to see some HRDx fans on here...

[kipper]

HRDx rock!! :rockon:

Yep the drive and more drive channels are kinda harsh but stick a $30 Bad Monkey on the clean channel and hey presto!!!

THey seem to work great with modellers too both in front of th amp and in the FX loop.

If you have a great clean channel you can always get good drive with the right pedal but if you aint got a good clean tone in the first place noting will sound good!

That's exactly what I do with my HRDx...use the clean channel to get a nice clean tone then add distortion, or other FX, to it using the Boss ME-50. The Boss may not be the best FX unit on the market, and probably not as good as dedicated pedals, but I think it's a great product for the money and suits my needs perfectly (and beyond at this point in time).

I'm particularly interested in your comment regarding the use of modellers with the HRDx. Which ones have you tried with yours? Even though I ditched my Valvetronix amp, I'd be interested to hear what a Tonelab sounds like through a HRDx! Would the HRDx not add some coloration to the modelled tone? For example, hook up a Tonelab and select the UK 80s setting (basically a 1983 Marshall stack)...would it sound like the modelled amp? Surely not. I always thought you needed a 'neutral' amp (like a Tech 21 Power Engine) or even a full-frequency amp (like a small PA or keyboard amp) when using modellers. Interested in your comments / experience with this!

I'm still tempted to get a Tonelab...it seems they are more reliable than the Chrome series amps from Vox and it would be nice to have some fun with it hooked up to my computer. But sure as anything I am now curious as to how it would sound through the HRDx!

[Rocket]

The problem with gigging most modelers & multi-effects peddles is the enormous amount of noise & RF they pick up. Good single pedals (like Boss) don't grab all that interference as they are well shielded.
The other problem is that they (modelers) tend to be relatively fragile in a hard & sometimes wet environment.
I have (small)gigged with a Digitech RP as it was durable and well shielded but I wouldn't trust it in adverse weather.

[Spudman]

Would the HRDx not add some coloration to the modelled tone? For example, hook up a Tonelab and select the UK 80s setting (basically a 1983 Marshall stack)...would it sound like the modelled amp? Surely not. I always thought you needed a 'neutral' amp (like a Tech 21 Power Engine) or even a full-frequency amp (like a small PA or keyboard amp) when using modellers. Interested in your comments / experience with this!



I wouldn't even think twice about this subject. Why? Because no matter what you play through it will 'color' the sound. You just need to decide if the "coloring" works for you or not.

Think like this - a 1983 Marshall stack with Vintage 30's is a different color than the same amp with G12-65s. No matter what changes you make you'll affect the color so don't get too hung up on something that will keep you from checking out a wonderful piece of gear like the Tonelab.

[kipper]

I wouldn't even think twice about this subject. Why? Because no matter what you play through it will 'color' the sound. You just need to decide if the "coloring" works for you or not.

Think like this - a 1983 Marshall stack with Vintage 30's is a different color than the same amp with G12-65s. No matter what changes you make you'll affect the color so don't get too hung up on something that will keep you from checking out a wonderful piece of gear like the Tonelab.

Interesting. Just one problem...I don't think I could get another piece of guitar equipment past the wife! Not just yet anyway :D

[Spudman]

Interesting. Just one problem...I don't think I could get another piece of guitar equipment past the wife! Not just yet anyway :D

Whadda ya mean? Haven't you had that for a long time but never brought it out until recently?;)

[kipper]

Whadda ya mean? Haven't you had that for a long time but never brought it out until recently?;)

Now there's an idea hehe :beer: :rockon:

[Spudman]

Now there's an idea hehe :beer: :rockon:

I have a long list of them...since I wrote the book.:D

[M29]

I had a HRDx and it was sweet! I loved the clean and verb and it would take any pedal I had and sound great. I got the 18 watt bug and everything I had had to go but I still like that HRDx.


Spud do you care to elaborate:poke:

M29

[Spudman]

Spud do you care to elaborate:poke:

M29

I'll dispense with face saving statements as needed. Do you need one? :poke: :D

[Lev]

I agree with Spud that everything will add a little something to a modeler but the cleaner the better. So the fact that the HRDx has plenty of clean headroom means that it will amplify your modeler pretty well without breaking up. I like the fact that it adds a bit of color to your tone, you can use the amp as a final EQ.

The other option is to put your modeler in the FX In jack, this means your modeler becomes a preamp and you're just using the power amp section of the amp. This will possibly give a truer representation of the modeler's tone but you gotta be real careful with your output volume from the modeler.

So the combination of a great clean channel with plenty of headroom along with an FX loop gives lots of options for use with a modeler.

I use the Zoom G2.1u in front of my HRDx with good results (admittedly at bedroom volumes). I'm also seriously considering a Vox Tonelab - I'm very impressed with the demo's I've heard, they've also come down in price quite a bit recently.

[Spudman]

The other option is to put your modeler in the FX In jack, this means your modeler becomes a preamp and you're just using the power amp section of the amp. This will possibly give a truer representation of the modeler's tone but you gotta be real careful with your output volume from the modeler.



I had one of those "oops" moments myself. It gets really loud in a painfully fast sort of way.

[ShortBuSX]

The other option is to put your modeler in the FX In jack, this means your modeler becomes a preamp and you're just using the power amp section of the amp. This will possibly give a truer representation of the modeler's tone but you gotta be real careful with your output volume from the modeler.


I could be wrong, but isnt the effects loop AFTER the preamp???
It might be a good idea to use a modeler there, but the rule I keep reading is timed effects like delay, chorus and such are good there.

[Spudman]

I could be wrong, but isnt the effects loop AFTER the preamp???
It might be a good idea to use a modeler there, but the rule I keep reading is timed effects like delay, chorus and such are good there.

You are right. Those effects do work well in that position but if you want to bypass the preamp then you can plug a modeler into the loop and then just use the modeler's output to control the volume because the power amp section will be running wide open.

In essence this give the modeler an uncolored, to a degree, power amp.

[ShortBuSX]

Wow!
I had to read that several times before it made sense to me...lemme see if I understand now.
So you plug your guitar dirrectly into the pedal and then out into the effects loop in?(or out?) but nothing going into input one or two???
Do I got this right now?

[t_ross33]

Wow!
I had to read that several times before it made sense to me...lemme see if I understand now.
So you plug your guitar dirrectly into the pedal and then out into the effects loop in?(or out?) but nothing going into input one or two???
Do I got this right now?
Guitar -> MFX pedal -> effects return or "in"

I have a "[EDIT] POWER AMP in" jack on the back of my Peavey Bandit that I run my GNX3K into - does the same thing - bypasses the preamp section of the amp, effectively making it just a power amp and speaker cab. All the amp voicing/EQ and effects come from the GNX3K. Works great! :rockon:

[Spudman]

Wow!
I had to read that several times before it made sense to me...lemme see if I understand now.
So you plug your guitar directly into the pedal and then out into the effects loop in?(or out?) but nothing going into input one or two???
Do I got this right now?

That is correct with a modeler.

The modeler replaces the preamp section of the guitar amp and by going out of the modeler and into the in of the effects loop on the amp you bypass the amps preamp section and thereby only use the power amp section of the amp.

Guitar>modeler instrument input>modeler output>amp effect loop input

[ShortBuSX]

Thanks for the explanation, Im still learnin bout this amp.

[kipper]

Interesting thread developing here...

Now with my Boss ME-50 in the chain would it not go like this...assuming I bought a ToneLab or even one of those new Fender-branded BOSS 'modeller' pedals (the "Bassman" pedal is rather tempting):

Guitar -> BOSS ME-50 -> modeller (with onboard FX bypassed) -> FX Input of the HRDx amp.

Would that be correct? I *THINK* it is because the ME-50 is designed to go BEFORE the preamp which in this case would be the modeller.

Have I got this right? :confused:

[Spudman]

I assume the ME50 is an effect pedal only?

If that is the case then yes it would be placed before any amph modeling or before an amph's input. However, depending on the ME50 effects you are using you could go:

Guitar>amp input
ME50 output>FX input(HRDX)>FX output(HRDX)>ME50 input
the ME50 will be in the amp's effect loop

[kipper]

I assume the ME50 is an effect pedal only?

If that is the case then yes it would be placed before any amph modeling or before an amph's input. However, depending on the ME50 effects you are using you could go:

Guitar>amp input
ME50 output>FX input(HRDX)>FX output(HRDX)>ME50 input
the ME50 will be in the amp's effect loop

Yes the ME-50 is a multi-FX unit only (no amp modelling) and it's designed to go before an amp's input, not in the FX loop. In fact there is no option to put it in the FX loop.

At the moment the signal path is this:

GUitar -> ME-50 -> HRDx

In fact Iv'e just taken a closer look at the HRDx "FX loop". The two sockets are labelled - left to right - "PREAMP OUT" and "POWER AMP IN". I've also looked at the BOSS FBM-1 '59 Bassman pedal manual and it must be placed in front of the amp, and after any FX device such as the ME-50.

So with the BOSS FBM-1 '59 Bassman pedal the signal path would be as follows:

Guitar -> ME-50 -> FBM-1 -> HRDx

I haven't heard the FDM-1 pedal but the demos of it on the BOSS website are pretty impressive. Maybe I'll start on new thread on these new BOSS pedals.

What's interesting as well is the manual has recommended settings for the pedal depending on what type of amp you are connecting to, i.e. stack, Fender combo, etc.

Uh-oh. I can feel some GAS coming on. :rockon:

I really like the sound of the '59 Bassman, and the "Tweed 4x10" model on my AD50VT was one of my favourite models when I had that amp. I wonder if BOSS are planning some more pedal-format modellers? I'd love an AC30 pedal, a JCM800 would be nice too.

Given that the '59 reissue amps are over twice the price of a HRDx, the BOSS pedal modeller could be a good way of getting the sound of one without breaking the bank balance...and it would be easier to get past the wife, unlike the much bigger and bulkier ToneLab :D

[Spudman]

Yes the ME-50 is a multi-FX unit only (no amp modelling) and it's designed to go before an amp's input, not in the FX loop. In fact there is no option to put it in the FX loop.



Sure you can. Some guys just use the choruses, delays, flanges etc. The way to do this is from the HRDX loop jacks go: Preamp out>ME input>ME output>power amp input.

[Lev]

Everything is possible, have a play around with putting FX in your loop. Some will work better than others but you might be surprised with the results.

The Boss GT10/08 have lots of cool routing possibilities when you have an amp with a loop. You can use what's called the 4cable method where effectively your amps preamp becomes a selectable 'model' on the GT because the modeller also has an FX loop. You can then route the GT stomp boxes (distortion/wah) in front of the preamp and modulation FX after. Very cool!

From what I've read the tonelab isn't as versatile because it's FX loop comes before the stomp boxes in the signal path.