Help with the Crate V5 choice

[Duff]

I have some guitar center incentives that I could apply to getting a V5. I have a V8 Palamino that I really like but wouldn't mind picking up a V5 if they are any good.

I have found out that I like small tube amps lately. You can crank them and they don't cause lots of problems and you can get some good tome.

I have at least three LOUD amps that can get a loud drummer screaming at me to turn down: ohhhhhh I love that! Ever have a drummer tell you to get a "real" amp because yours isn't loud enough. P####s you off.

Anyway, anyone get one of these V5's and how does it sound? Is it really cool? I've heard you can upgrade them plus i noticed it has a jack to connect to a different cabinet.

I would like to know how many ohms is the speaker in the Crate V5 amp?

Thanks,

Duffy

[piebaldpython]

You better test that Crate V5 out first Duff. See the link below, but people on MF pretty much say it sucks.

http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Crate-V-Series-V5-5W-1x10-Tube-Guitar-Combo-Amp?sku=487050&src=3WFRWXX&ZYXSEM=0&CAWELAID=93570291

Good luck with that and keep us posted. BTW Duff, I have a Behringer GM110 on order from AudioAllies per your recommendation. Thanks dude,

[just strum]

Save a little more money and get this.

http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/product/Epiphone-Valve-Junior-Combo-Amp?sku=480260

[tunghaichuan]

I played a V5 in a guitar store a while back, and it didn't sound all that good to me. Very boxy due to the small speaker and small cabinet. It may sound better through a larger speaker and cabinet, though.

A properly modded Valve Junior head through a 12" speaker cabinet kills the V5 tone wise.

Still, if you're set on the V5, I would swap out the tubes and speaker. If you want some suggestions for modding the circuit, I'll dig out the schematic and take a look.

tung

[just strum]

I'm hearing that the latest rev Valve Jr does not need to have any mod work done, unless you want to change tubes. I'm not sure if that is true, but that is what I am hearing.

IMO, it would be better to buy the combo and if you want to add a 12", then hook it up to a cab. This way if you want to go jam and want to carry as little as possible, you take the combo and leave the cab at the practice location - just my $0.02 from a person that knows little, but can offer only opinion.

[tunghaichuan]

I'm hearing that the latest rev Valve Jr does not need to have any mod work done, unless you want to change tubes. I'm not sure if that is true, but that is what I am hearing.


I've heard a few people say you don't need to mod the newest verison (revision 3) of the amp. It does sound pretty good stock. However, I think it can benefit from a few minor mods. Some would argue with me that you don't really need to change the output transformer, but my modded rev. 3 head sounds better to me than my stock one. I have a Hammond 125ESE in the modded head. It's a subtle improvement, but I like it a great deal. There are also a few resistor tweaks. At the very least, I would swap out the 12AX7 for a 5751 and the EL84 for a JJ EL84.



IMO, it would be better to buy the combo and if you want to add a 12", then hook it up to a cab. This way if you want to go jam and want to carry as little as possible, you take the combo and leave the cab at the practice location - just my $0.02 from a person that knows little, but can offer only opinion.

Excellent idea, Strum. Why didn't I think of that? :thwap: The Rev. 3 combo is the same chassis as the head and has the three output jacks (4, 8, 16 ohm), so you can interface it with just about any cabinet. I would, however, upgrade the stock speaker.

tung

[just strum]

...Some would argue with me that you don't really need to change the output transformer, but my modded rev. 3 head sounds better to me than my stock one. I have a Hammond 125ESE in the modded head. It's a subtle improvement, but I like it a great deal. There are also a few resistor tweaks. At the very least, I would swap out the 12AX7 for a 5751 and the EL84 for a JJ EL84.

I also heard that about the output transformer. I forgot about that because I tuned in to "no mod needed". I guess what I should say is that I heard the stock one is good as is (as compared to the earlier versions). Just like anything, improvements can be made, but I believe they are less expensive and time consuming.




Excellent idea, Strum. Why didn't I think of that? :thwap: The Rev. 3 combo is the same chassis as the head and has the three output jacks (4, 8, 16 ohm), so you can interface it with just about any cabinet. I would, however, upgrade the stock speaker.

I continue to kick around the speaker change for the ad30vt and the valve jr. I'm considering the Jensen MOD, but I'm not sure how much I will lose in an attempt to save money as compared to say a Celestion speaker - that's not a question, since I already threw out that question in discussion, it's just me writing out loud.

tung[/QUOTE]

[Duff]

piebaldpython,
Make sure you let us know what you think about my recommendation on the GM110 Behringer. I was wrong about the discontinuance aparantly; since it is listed on the Behringer homepage. I thought it was superceded with the digital window one that doesn't get the same rep. and doesn't have the built in DI out box and added connectivity.
I think the GM110 is a really nice analog moddeling amp, limitted to selected tones but set up like a real nice rig with a master vol, etc, quality ten inch speaker, tons of volume, solid build, etc.
I'll be highly interested in your opinion. You can go from clean to super heavy distorted metal with very quick switching. For 99 dollars it's a great value and don't be surprised if audioallies has it to you way before you were expecting to get it.
Eagerly awaiting your opinion. Fairly confident you will be a proponent of the amp, no affilliation w the seller.

Also, on a different note: I called the Crate tech dude today and he actually recommended that since I already have the Crate Palamino V8 that I probably wouldn't like the sound of the V5 based upon his feedback from V8 owners. I had a feeling that V8 was an awesome item. So the dude was really honest. I told him I didn't work for the company and wasn't a secret caller. He was glad to be truthful.

He spoke extremely highly of, and owns one, the RFX/VFX 200S, solid state, three channel w eq section for each channel and quality built in stereo in some cases effects. I really want one of those.

I bought my son a RFX65 and it is awesome dark brown with gold trim and the three channels w the separate eq sections for each and the effects section. He loves it.

So, I would look for an RFX or VFX Crate 200S or 120 2 by 12, without too much question, no affilliation with the seller, just sharing some direct info from the tech dude. Can you believe he suggested NOT getting the V5 based upon his interpretation of where I'm coming from and owning a V8? Honest dude.

I have the V3 Valve Jr. head and it is nice. However, I have been keeping my 3/5 watt Blackheart head hooked up to the Epi V Jr 12 inch cab for some awesome sound.

Should hook up my V3 V Jr to my Epi So. Cal. four by twelve and enjoy this nice amp as well. I have an extra cable but have been hooking up the extension speaker jack on my new Peavey Delta Blues to the cab for some really fun low volume fullness of tone and great sound with all those speakers pushing a little air each. Neat concept to an old problem: good tone at low volume.

Another one of my long posts.

This thread has a lot of meat to it.

As far as the speaker swap goes on the valvetronix, Bill M at the Fender Forum is an awesome expert on the new Fender Super Champ XD tube pream and power amp but has a digital effects and amp modelling chip that inserts somewhere in the circuit to produce a highly praised amp, even by those extremely serious obsessive and CRITICAL dudes at the Fender forum. They love the XD.

Anyway Bill M, of significant renown, recommended the Emminence Ragin' Cajun as the best speaker he tested for the modelling Fender SCXD. Therefore, with great confidence I ordered from MF a Emminence Ragin' Cajun ten inch speaker with a magnet that weighs at least four time the stock Fender speaker and put it in right away and noticed a GREAT increase of volume due to the greater sensitivity. A little bit of sensitivity equals lots of volume. Like the difference between 98dB and 101 dB is a big difference in volume. And the tone is really good and works really well in modelling amps that are called upon to replicate the specific sound of a lot of different amps, no small task and not up to all speakers. The Ragin' Cajun cost 65 thru MF and was wellworth it and is supposedly superior to the "Mod" Jensen line, no offense intended, based upon my limitted research which is probably more than limitted and more like extensive overly time consuming obsession. That SDXD sounds unreal and I recently drownded out a LOUD drummer and had him yelling at me to turn down: oooooh that made me feel good. He once told me to "get a real amp" because my amp wasn't loud enough. From now on I'm always going to start out loud and get him to wave me down. We are best of friends and it's an inside joke deal. He is the only person that I know that built a house with a "closet" woodstove, also inside joke; that really got him going when I said that because it is surrounded by beautiful mortared river rock and is an antique rebuilt airtight woodstove that is awesomely nice, just like his vintage Rodgers drum set and professional level of playing.

Anyway, consider the Emminence Ragin' Cajun from someone who put one in to great satisfaction. Highly sensitive speaker built really well.

I'm thinking about putting one in my Crate Flexwave 15R with a twelve inch speaker, if they make it in 12 inch. The Crate speaker in that 12 inch flexwave looks unimpressive but sounds good. The magnet is about two ounces. Very tiny diminutive looking thing visible behind the amp. A big magnet would look so coooool sitting inside there in totally plain sight and the sound would definitely be louder and more tonefull, for sure. That amp is a really nice amp for 99 dollars; no effects except reverb but a good eq and a really nice drive channel.

I was thinking of getting a Peavey Vypyr 15 instead of the V5 that I have ruled out; except the reviews on the Vypyr 15 are not great, flimsy construction, etc. I like the looks of the amp though.

I am going to the weekend sale prepared to jump on some unforseen blowout item. I might even find a decent bass to use for backup or something else unforseen that catches my eye. You can get unbelievable deals at those GC sale days. That's where I got my "Cherry Burst" Squire strat for 167.

This visit will be interesting. I have fifty dollars credit at GC I need to use. Maybe I'll buy a bass pedal.

Any suggestions for a bass pedal that is awesome?

Duffy

All worked up. Hey that sounds like the title of a decent rock song.

[just strum]

Damn Duffy, my fingers get sore just looking at that post. Must be a lot in that head of yours. My head is near empty and I just pushed it to the limits with this post.

[just strum]

Duff,

I got a little lot there - what amp did you install the Ragin' Cajun in?

[Duff]

There is a lot going on in that thread.

Are you going think about that Emminence Ragin' Cajun?

It's worth looking at, especially for a modelling amp.

Duffy

Mine's awesome.

[just strum]

There is a lot going on in that thread.

Are you going think about that Emminence Ragin' Cajun?

It's worth looking at, especially for a modelling amp.

Duffy

Mine's awesome.

I'm kicking around speakers for both amps. I'll PM you later - don't want to get carried away with a hijack

[piebaldpython]

DUFF,
I am so busy with stuff I haven't had the chance to test drive the GM110. What I can say is this in the meantime: I called audioallies on Monday morning and I had the amp by Wednesday!!! OK, I'm in Philly and I think he said he was in NJ, but DAMN, 2 days!! Awesome. :bravo:
Like I said, my time is limited, I'm pretty much a beginner+ who was looking for a direction to go. I chose electric and decided to get an amp, but not with a lot of $$$'s involved because of my time issues. So, I researched the hell out of it, thought about the Tech 21 because of the analog. I decided against digital for the most part because I didn't need/want F/X.
I decided against the VOX DA-5 because of the small speaker and I don't need portability. I have a wife, so going out to play (with adorable dog in tow) and seeing who I attract is something I don't need to do. ahahhahhahahahhaahhahahahh
Decided against tube amp for concerns 1)shipping and having a carton of broken glass and 2) just the lack of time that I don't have to wait for the tubes to get good and cookin'. That being said, IF I get proficient on guitar, I will go tubular in a heartbeat. If I get really awesome, then I'll call Tung and DVM to hook me up real special-like before I tour. :rotflmao:
So, I decided on the GM110 for a number of reasons:1) the price was right, 2) it has the faux SANSAMP analog tech of the Tech 21 amps and I really like that sound, 3) it has an effects return port that I could plug some stuff into if I wanted a certain sound (Bad Monkey), 4) it has a good 10" speaker, 5) headphone access and 6) direct line out.
In short, it sounded like an amp that I could get a nice variety of sounds with for playing bluesy kind of stuff. So, a clean sound with some distortion if I want. I don't need NUCLEAR capabilities.
It has DRIVE to alter the clean sound, 3 knob EQ....perfect.
Once I start playing her for about a couple of weeks, I'll report back with my feelings. Do not expect the detail that DUFF gives though. :D

[Duff]

Pretty sure this amp will blow your mind. It will go NUCLEAR. That HiGain setting.

It's nice clean too. Notice how heavy it is. Since this may be your only amp you may even want eventually to replace the speaker with an even better more sensitive and therefore loud one. The amp is plenty loud to overcome a loud drummer. Just did it a couple weeks ago and the drummer was waving it down.

Plenty of basic tones you can add your multipedal or other pedals to. I think it is best to put the bad monkey in front of the amp input. Delay and time based effects work best in the loop I believe. Eq works good in the loop too I know. But at your level you will have plenty of fun just enjoying this super neat and highly rated amp, I think.

It's cool without any pedals and is versitile. You have to tweak the eq and volume and drive and so forth to get the different sliding model switches to produce the best sound in each setting. You can't just switch them around and expect it to sound good because each model responds like the original type amp and needs to have you tweak the eq, drive, vol, etc., to get the best out of it. I still don't have it down all the way but it is definitely a great amp at a unbelievable price. I should buy another one before they are all gone. I think they are one of the best Behringer amps made, actually made with high quality, even though the company gets a bad rap on quality that it may not fully deserve, especially with this amp. Read harmonycentral.com user reviews of it.

Duff

I'm sure you will have fun with it and be AMAZED for the price.

[Andy]

I think they are one of the best Behringer amps made, actually made with high quality, even though the company gets a bad rap on quality that it may not fully deserve, especially with this amp.

heres a strait up, no nonsense review of a beringer(bugera) amp from tone king.He's an everyday guy who posts honest reviews.
worth watching.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpzLxmA45HA

I can't comment personally on the brand but don't always just go by the "pro" reviews..if alot of people are complaining about the quality , there must be some reason behind it. this review shows some of them first hand.

*note- I disagree with his means of testing the noise gate.

[wingsdad]

......the GM110 Behringer. I was wrong about the discontinuance aparantly; since it is listed on the Behringer homepage. ...
Duff,
I had one of these in it's earliest version, known as the 'Vintager 30', about 5 years ago as they were coming out with the V-Tone series. Back then, it was a bold-faced Behringer reverse-engineered clone of the Tech21 Trademark 30, down to the retro chicken-head knobs, but without reverb. It was 100 bucks then, vs. the T21's $300 tag. So that's the model that's discontinued, replaced by this less-retro styled GM110.

I got it because I counted on it being a poor-man's T21. Reviews on it at the time were generally stellar, even at harmony central where things can be a bit flakey, to say the least.

I didn't keep it that long. It was nice enough, but the lack of reverb onboard was a major drag, and the speaker was 'muddy'...just incapable of good clear cleans.

If you can track down a used T21 Trademark 30 it might be $150-$200. New, they're still $300. But you'd have the real deal - with an Accutronics reverb tank and a decent speaker...you could check with T21 over the phone, but I think their 'Special Design' speakers are still made for them by Celestion.

Tech21 Trademark 30 (http://www.tech21nyc.com/tm30.html)

IMHO and that of many who review T21's professionally, they make the most realistically tube-like sounding solid state amps you can get without the maintenance headaches and variables of tubes. I've got Trademark 60 and I've commented on it many times here.

Just to clarify: I'm not knocking Behringer...they make a load of great bang-for-the buck stuff with their reverse-engineering designs. I have and/or have had many of their products, and I recommend them often as solutions to the budget-concious who want that b-f-t-b. And I'm not saying the new GM110 isn't a good buy, just that for a bit more green, the T21 is far & away superior.

[Duff]

Yo. Not to argue with you but the review with the link is a completely a different amp. It is a 333 something head Bugera amp by supposedly Behringer. His even has reverb which he describes.

My GM110 sounds nothing like this and is supposed to be a Tech 21 clone and doesn't sound anything like this messy sounding review.

Also, the first Youtube comment posted about his review follows:

Quote from Andy's link of the youtube review:

"Man, I've got the Bugera 333XL combo and it sound awesome, I just think this guys doesn't really know what he's talking about here. The only thing he's right about is the noise gate, it doesn't do a hell of alot, noticably anyhows. And there is a difference with the XL button. I really think there must be something personal with these amps for this guy because he seems way to eager to try and kill everything about this amp, when everyone including myself who owns one thinks they are great amps. "

This is a completely different amp from the one I suggested: the GM110, which is really a neat thirty watt amp for 98 dollars. It doesn't have any "xl" button. Isn't even at all like the reviewed amp dude.

Several super great guitar players have played my GM110 and really, really like it and can't believe the price.

I also notice when he tests the amp after he presses the xl button he doesn't re tweak the amp or anything. Plus it looks like he has stuff hooked up.

Here is another quote following Andy's youtube review of some other behringer supposedly amp, same review, another comment:

"The noise gate is not there to get rid of created feedback,its there to make the amp quiet,and it works just fine.The whole point of the noise gate is that it does its job without affecting the tone of the amp at all.If you can't dial a decent tone from this amp,then you should considder another instrument.Its by far one of the best sounding amps on the market today. "

And, these guys are reviewing the amp that the guy from Andy's link reviewed, not the GM110.

And check this comment of the same youtube, you can read them yourself. Andy, dude, did you read the comments of his review?

Quote:

"This is one of the most ill informed reviews I've seen.1,the XL buttons only kick in when you dial the low end higher,then you can tell the difference,the XL button adds a tight low and thump to the tone.The gain on the lead channel will not give loads of saturation dialed at 12 oclock.Turn it all the way up and it matches anything I've tried on the market in almost 30 years of playing.If you dial the gain on a recto at 12 oclock on the lead channel,its not going to move the earth. "

And the noise gate comments by this obviously non technical reviewer:

Quote:

"Quoted right from the Bugera site, About the XL Switch.

"XL switch that not only gives low-volume output a punchy boost in the low frequencies, but also functions as a noise gate."

This is why your noise gate test didnt work. "

Read this quote from the same comments on the youtube Andy posted:

Quote:


"Wow. I hate to disagree with the "Tone King" but you have a defective unit there. While I agree that the noise gate does'nt do much, the XL feature on mine makes a huge difference on the gain and tone. Plus, the gain and tone on mine is much thicker. Even the cleans are better. I don't understand, MUST be defective. My controls rock a bit too, but it's not because of plastic knobs, it's because of plastic shafts. Damn corner cutting chinese! But hey, 600 bucks vs. 2500 or more, right? "

I don't know Andy. You must have the wrong Youtube or something. This is not even remotely close to the amp I am discussing. This is really not related to it in any way.

The amp I'm discussing is a Behringer GM110 solid state; not a Bugera tube amp like the one you aparently reviewed, even though you say it is a head and say it's solid state, or the reviewer says this. Very confusing review, done poorly, as noted by the comments that follow it. Even the guitar was questioned and his knowledge of how a noise gate works.

The Behringer GM110 has a ten inch Bugera speaker in it. That is all that is Bugera about it. It is not a Bugera amp.

No offense to you, but possibly by no intentional oversight by you, this Youtube review is not applicable to the amp I am discussing. The review is mis information. Incorrect information. Presented by a guy that is very vague about what he describes he is testing and doesn't seem to have much technical knowledge of how to hook things up to the head and set his eq, etc.

Plus like the one commenter said it would have helped if he had videotaped the whole set up, loop, etc., so we could understand just exactly why he was getting such a bad sound out of what was otherwise considered to be a good head.


Not the same amp or even close. I don't even think it is the same company.

No offense. Probably just a misunderstanding.



Duff

[Duff]

Zzounds has a Crate V100H V-Series Tube Guitar Amplifier Head (100 Watts) on sale for 290 resealed, 330 new.

4 x 12AX7 preamp tubes, 4 x EL34 power tubes. Spring Reverb with Level Control. 4, 8 and 16 ohm Speaker Ouputs. Two channels, clean and drive. EQ for each channel.

I have no relationship to Zzounds or any other company. Just giving some more info on these great Crate V series deals. This sounds like one nice head.

Hope this helps someone,

Duffy

[Andy]

sorry , guess I posted the wrong thing ,amp. maker, but it's not my review, I repeat not my review ..sorry for the confusion ..carry on folks

[Duff]

Yo, dude. No problem. I give out wrong info sometimes too.

Also, I'm sure that not everyone is a fan of the GM110. Many people stay clear of Behringer. My Behringer EQ is noisy, maybe it would be quieter in the loop. I'm not enough of an expert. I do understand electronics, however to some extent, by necessity.

Back in the early 70s I bought a brand new motorcycle and none none of the mechanics around me knew anything about diagnosing any electrical problems except for the most simple ones. They didn't even know how to track a circuit from the battery to its terminal point or from the fuse box to its component. I solved so many problems myself and troubleshot so many electrical problems I can't believe it.

I just soldered the PCB board on my VOX DA5, an outstanding little amp; because it had cracked solder joints that connect to the power source input jack. I carefully soldered them with a pencil tip soldering iron, 15 watts and super thin, 1mm rosin core lead containing electronic solder. Works perfect now. Someone else might have wanted to replace the entire PCB board.

I think that guy was working on a Bugera amp not a Behringer amp and he may not have had adequate knowledge of the head itself and his other gear attached to it and how to test them, again, no offense, just my observation.

Behringer has one of those stigmatized reputations but I think, like Squire, it is moving up in the world.

By the way my GM110 is not called the Vintager, but I think it might be the same amp, unless the Vintager had a tube in it. The GM 110 has a lot going for it and solid construction is one of them.

Peace,

Duffy

[wingsdad]

...By the way my GM110 is not called the Vintager, but I think it might be the same amp, unless the Vintager had a tube in it. The GM 110 has a lot going for it and solid construction is one of them. ...
The "Vintager" that I had was basically the same solid state analog modeling amp as the current GM110, with the cosmetic differences I described (knobs, also a chrome top control panel plate). The took the 'Vintager' name off it to change it to part of the V-Tone series, adding the GMX110, a little different, with FX onboard. Shiner, here, has one (I'd suggested it to him) & to re-introduce the name as their little Vintager tube amps currently in their product line.

[Duff]

Did you check out the amp yet?

My guess is that you are going to like it a lot.

Found some great reviews on Ultimateguitar.com I think it is. Reviews of the GM110, like you got. Well received amp.

You got some analog modelling for 98 dollars and a loud thirty watts.

Takes some time to learn how to adjust for the various model combinations; just like on my Fender SCXD. The models are like the real amps and you need to adjust the volume, drive and eq, plus any other adjustments on the amp to get the best sound. You can't just switch the switches and expect to get the right sound out of the model because it changes the control panel requirements in a way that they need to be reset to where the analog model wants them for the best tone. Repititious, I know, but some people think they can just start turning model switches on modelling amps and then complain when the model doesn't sound right.

Hope you like it,

Duffy

[piebaldpython]

This is a very busy time of year for the PBP clan as ALL of our B-days are within a 3 week span plus our anniversary (29th), plus fiscal end of year stuff at work and my upcoming colonoscopy this Thursday (:D ); I just haven't had the time to test drive her due to my dance card being FULL. :bravo: I hope to do so this weekend. Believe me, once I take her out for a spin, I'll report pronto. :rotflmao: