Song Writing and Composing

[jpfeifer]

O.K. all of you fretters out there. How many of you like to write your own music? My question to you is, what is your process for writing tunes? Everyone seems to have their own way for getting their song ideas together, and different ways to get the muse going.

For myself, I get inspired by listening to other music. Sometimes I'll hear a groove or a sound in a song that catches my ear and makes me start thinking of a new song. Or sometimes it's a place that I visit that makes me feel a certain way.

The best way for me to work when I'm trying to write is to minimize the distractions and focus on hearing the song in my head. If I start messing too much with equipment and getting the right tone, etc. the idea seems to evaporate. I have to capture it while it's still in my head. For that reason I leave my recording equipment setup so that I can quickly record a scratch track for an idea then go back and try to develop it.

The problem that I keep running into is that I'll start to compose a tune, then through the process of refining it I begin to hate it. :-) I think that this is when it helps to have another song writer that you collaborate with. I have a bunch of tunes started but left unfinished. The ones that I really like, I finish up. This is my process for weeding out the bad ones, or at least the ones that I don't think are interesting.

Anyway, I'd be interested in hearing other composer's ideas for getting their songs put together. We can all learn something from each other.

-- Jim

[Katastrophe]

For me, it's usually a particular sound that gets me going. I'll be fiddling around with the pedal and come up with one of the presets and start practicing. From there, just noodling, I'll stumble upon a riff that will sound good as a beginning, or a lead in to a chorus. Once I have a chorus, the verses just seem to fall into place, along with a vocal melody.

Song lyrics, on the other hand, are a whole 'nuther story. I can usually come up with a catchy chorus, but for some reason, my verses sound cheesy to me. Either their oversimplified, or just waaaaaaaay too complicated.

Thank God for my other guitar player. He's great at coming up with direct, simple phrases that make sense.

I like to collaborate anyway. It's more fun writing with a group for me.

[Spudman]

There is a serious lack of composers around here so everything gets fleshed out by me.

First I get an idea which is sometimes a riff or a rhythm or I even hear most of the song playing in my head sometimes.

Next I start putting the idea down into a recorder. I try to find some other parts such as bridge, chorus, whatever and just get it recorded so it isn't lost. The first idea is usually the best so I keep a small cassette recorder on my amp just in case. The other thing I use it the Boss Loop Station to capture the ideas as they flow.

Then I piece it together. I mess with the arrangement until I'm reasonable happy. Sometimes more ideas will sprout while I'm changing the order. I try to capture those ideas as well.

A lot of times the lyrics will come with the music. The tone or mood of the music will often dictate the lyrics. Other times I just go through my notebooks and try any lyrics with the song. I'll usually know quickly if it is a match.

The best ones though are the ones that write themselves. I do this a lot at jams. I'll start playing something and everyone else joins in. Then I walk up to the mic and project a song as though it was one that I had written some time before. Most of the time the other players never notice that I'm creating on the spot and ask "who wrote that" when we finish. It's a real treat to tell them "you just did."

[6STRINGS 9LIVES]

Jim , most of my stuff starts with the hook , it can be a lyrical hook that i will write the melody for, or a particular melody that i fit a scat lyric to and then find the guitar part . Inspiration comes from many sources , like you i often find it in other musical ideas, no shame there theres only so many notes on the board and they have all been used before .. particular feels in certain songs sometimes will spur a bout of creativity .. i've been writing since the late 70's and while i have written lots on my own i find colobaration by far the most satisfying , i have written lyrics and sent them to friends with whom i have worked with , i have done the same with melodys and riffs., sometimes there comes a point in writing a song where you simply hit the wall and can go no farther with the idea , thats when i file them away and wait until i am sitting with someone and break it out to see where they can take it , i have some unfinished songs that are 25 years old just waiting for the moment ..its a funny thing .. for years i have kept a cheap radio shack micro cassette recorder in the car for those moments when an idea pops in .. of all the songs i have written only a few were written in one sitting most took hours of going back and re-writing and re-arranging , the other thing that happens quite frequently is that two seperate unfinished ideas or lyrics , melodys , bits and pieces get combined to form a complete song ..one thing that i have used religiously over the years is to use a journal type book to write my ideas down in , i date each idea and date each journal and from time to time when i am looking for that line to finish a verse or to complete an idea i'll go back to the old journal and find a chestnut to use , same with my tapes and demos , some recordings are as short as 10-15 seconds but often turn out to be useful .. i guess the thing is dont ever trash anything , keep it all and revisit it from time to time .. i literally have a 4 drawer filing cabinet full of musical ideas from the last 26 years , one day i'll have to transfer it to the pc but not today .great topic Jim .....6S9L

[jpfeifer]

I like to see how other people go through the creative process. I've read a lot of interviews with different songwriters and many of them have similar stories about how they come up with their material.

There are those few cases where the song kind of drops out of the sky and writes itself. (those are less common but great when they happen). Then there are the more common ones that need to be worked and reworked until they reveal themselves, kind of like a sculpture or something.

I remember reading some stuff about Paul McCartney and John Lennon and how they would meld songs together from two different song ideas that they had. I think that this is why there songs were so good. Paul had more of the optimistic and pop sounding side and John had more of the edgey and melancholy side.

There's something very spiritual about the whole song writing process and I find that interesting too. One of my friends like to meditate to clear his mind. He tells me that he gets a lot of song ideas after meditating. I think that there is some truth to that. When I'm writing there seems to be this place that I have to get to in my mind where I have my antenna up listening for new ideas. Many times the ideas simply don't come. If I think too hard about it, the reception goes bad (to draw on that analogy). But I do think that song writing is a skill that you can get better and better at over time. It's a process of learning how to listen for new ideas in your head, along with the more cerebral process of working out the song structure once you have the nugget of an idea.

-- Jim

[Spudman]

Jim

I really relate to what you said. Like you, many of the articles and interviews I've read the artist points out that they are just receiving the input from somewhere outside themselves. Me too. It's like it already exists and I'm just there to catch it when it comes along. I mentioned this below when I talk about jamming with the guys. I feel like the song is already there. Maybe it isn't as refined but it exists none the less. John Lennon said that around 20 minutes is about all the time he will give a song to be created. But we all know that it gets refined after that and it takes a lot of time to get it recorded properly.

When your friend meditates (I do too) you empty or quiet all the things going on in your mind and make space. When you have the space is only when something else can come in (the song).

One cool place that I get melodies from is a box fan. For some reason when I put this thing in my window and there is no other noise in the house I can hear what seems to be far off melodies coming from the fan. I don't know if it is RF being generated or wind noise or what. I know it's strange, but I'm wondering if anyone else has this experience?

[aeolian]

I do try to write my own music, but all I've even done are instrumentals. I would like to write a song with lyrics some time. Actually I do have a scrap of lyrics somewhere that I started but never finished.

I only really know one way of starting to write an instrumental and that is to make up a chord progression. I usually start with having made up a progression which I use for the verse, then I figure something out for a bridge. Since I don't have the deterity to figure out a lead line when I get this far, I typically record a backing track with the chord progression, then I flesh out the melody line. The following are a couple of songs I did this way:

http://home.comcast.net/~kitn13/music/quest.mp3 - The Unanswered Question

http://home.comcast.net/~kitn13/music/starlit.mp3 - Starlit Sky

One time I decided to try and write a song but forcing myself not to start with a chord progression, but using a riff. The result is:

http://home.comcast.net/~kitn13/music/takeout.mp3 - Chinese Takeout

I have a few more things sitting around, but I don't want to be embarrassed too much.

aeolian