Epiphone Valve Junior Modifications

[duhvoodooman]

The 5W Epiphone Valve Junior has certainly gotten its share of press here at TheFret.net, being the subject of the longest single thread (http://www.thefret.net/showthread.php?t=74) in this forum's brief history (212 posts and counting as of today, 6/20/06), and deservedly so. This little gem has quickly established a cult following, since it offers genuine class A tube amp vibe for a ridiculously low price ($140 for the combo, $100 for the head). And you can pick up used examples of the combo version in good condition on eBay for well under $100 (I got mine for $92).

But rather than further effuse over its goodness, which Nelskie, Tone2thebone and others have already done in the aforementioned thread, I thought I'd post my experiences, both completed and in progress, with modifying this amp to improve its tone and performance further. Nelksie talked about swapping tubes and changing the stock speaker, but I want to get into some more fundamental changes here, involving making additions and substitutions in the amp's electrical chassis componentry. These modifications are covered in much more detail on some other websites, and I won't endeavor to go into the technical depth they do. But these are the websites where I found all of the information that I base my following comments upon, so check them out if you want more detail:

Erik Miller's VJr Mods at Euthymia Electronics (http://www.euthymia.org/DIY/VJmods.html)

Dennis Cronin's VJr Mod Site (http://www.valvejunior.com/)

Svokke's VJr Mod Page (http://users.telenet.be/svokke/valve%20junior%20mods.htm)

Brian Oddi's VJr. Mod thread at Kluge Music (http://www.klugemusic.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=78)

VJr Mod Thread at Hoffman Amps (http://www.hoffmanamps.com/Forum/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1143949702/114)

As good as the original combo version of the VJr was, it had some shortcomings, too--completely understandable in an amp this inexpensive. First and foremost is it's propensity to hum. In fact, the amp hums in two completely different ways--a low-level background hum that is independent of the amp's volume setting, and a more obnoxious "buzzy" hum that builds as the volume is increased. On the VJr combo I bought, the former was practically unnoticeable to me, but the latter was pretty bad with the volume up past 2 PM or so. I found several different mods that were designed to reduce either or both of these hum types, ranging from very simple to fairly involved. The good news is that none of them are expensive, so I elected to do several of them and see how much improvement I could get. (Note: These hum deficiencies were addressed in the head version of the VJr, and I understand new production of the combo incorporates the fixes, too.)

A second shortcoming that I noticed in my VJr was a rather dull tone, lacking "top end". I found myself maxing out the treble tone controls on all of my guitars when I played though it. Though the mod sites listed above tended to go after the hum issues as the primary improvement need, all of them made changes that boosted the amp's top end to some extent, as well, so I was obviously not alone in my opinion. Since I don't often crank the volume up into the range where the buzzy hum gets bad, I actually considered this need for more brightness to be my first priority. I swapped the stock Sovtek tubes for JJ's from Eurotubes.com (http://www.eurotubes.com/), and though the amp's tone improved and brightened slightly, the improvement was nowhere near what I was looking for.

In addition to the above two issues, a number of other mods were described at these various websites, mostly falling into the category of enhancements to the VJr's intentionally sparse feature set. These included things like adding a high gain switch, an additional 8 ohm output jack, or installing a small light bulb to act as a signal attenuator. However, I had no personal need for or interest in any of these, and opted to pass on implementing them.

To deal with the hum issues, I decided to make the following four modifications:


Improve grounding on the PCB by adding a jumper wire between two of the traces. This corrects a grounding design deficiency.
Replace the stock input jack with a nylon insulated jack, to isolate it from the chassis.
Add a larger filtering capacitor (100uf/450V) to the main high voltage supply to supplement the smaller stock caps.
Convert the voltage supply to the tube heater filaments from AC to DC, requiring the addition of a small bridge rectifier and 1000uf/25V capacitor.

To improve the brightness characteristics of the amp, I opted for two additional mods:


Boost the amount of input signal going to the preamp stage and reduce the signal bleed to ground by changing two resistors on the PCB. The resistor change also causes a net increase in the input impedance of the amp, which effectively boosts the highs a bit.
Add a switchable tone capacitor to an open position on the PCB, i.e. install "brightness switch".


Progress as of 6/20/06:

Hum Fix: Finished #1 and implemented a temporary version of #2, basically using a rubber washer and some strategically applied electrical tape to isolate the stock metal input jack from the chassis. In the meantime, the parts for #'s 3 and 4, plus a real nylon insulated jack to do #2 right, are on order from Mouser.com (http://www.mouser.com/). At this point, the background hum is essentially inaudible, but I haven't implemented the fixes (esp. #4) that will hopefully tame most of the volume-dependent buzz.

Brightness Boost: Completed #5, resulting in a noticeable boost in the high-end, but I still want more. Additionally, the amp's effective gain was increased by changing the resistor to ground to 1M ohm, sending more signal to the preamp. This made the amp noticeably louder at a given volume setting. It makes the volume-dependent buzz proportionally louder, too! I have the parts on order from Mouser.com for mod #6, as well--a simple on/off toggle switch and some ceramic capacitors in sizes of 50, 68 and 100pf. I'll start out by installing the 68pf cap and see how the brightness sounds when switched on. If it's not enough I can go up to the 100pf cap, and if it's too much, I can back off to the 50pf. These caps cost less than a buck each, so I figured why not get a couple to experiment with?

I'll update this thread further after I receive and install the additional mod parts, hopefully by later this week. BTW, the total of all the parts only came to about $22, so these are definitely not expensive mods to make!

[Bloozcat]

Good thread, buddy! I'm looking forward to hearing more.

[duhvoodooman]

The parts for the additional mods arrived from Mouser.com yesterday, and I got everything installed during my lunch hour today, with the help of an accomplished solderer. Specifically, the following mods were completed:

Replaced the stock input jack with a nylon insulated jack, isolating it from the chassis.
Added a larger (!) filtering capacitor (100uf/450V) to the main high voltage supply to supplement the smaller stock caps.
Converted the voltage supply to the tube heater filaments from AC to DC, by installing a small bridge rectifier and 1000uf/25V capacitor.
Installed a tone capacitor to an open position on the PCB, and connected it to an on/off toggle on the front panel, creating a "brightness switch".

Here's a simple schematic of the Valve Jr's PCB, showing the mods that were done today on the board itself, plus the resistor change I made a few days ago:

http://duhvoodooman.com/miscimages/VJr_mod_schematic.gif


Here's a photo of a portion of the PCB itself, showing some of the mods, circled in red and numbered:

http://duhvoodooman.com/miscimages/VJr_mod_PCB_2.jpg


The mods shown are as follows:

The bridge rectifier and 1000uf/25V capacitor. The orange wires formerly connected to terminals T5 and T6 on the PCB, but now connect to the rectifier, whose + and - terminals now connect to those board terminals.
68pf tone capacitor, soldered to one of the two open C3 terminals on the PCB. The other end is wired to the toggle switch in the panel face (#5), and the other side of the switch is wired back to the second C3 terminal.
The two resistors (R1 and R2) that were substituted for the stock resistors, per my original posting.
The back of the new nylon insulated input jack.
The back of the "brightness switch" toggle.

Here's a different view of the PCB, showing the big 100uf/450V filter capacitor , which is wired in parallel with the smaller filter caps on the board. The connection points are circled in red. The capacitor is lashed down to the board with a wire tie fastened to an adhesive anchor pad.

http://duhvoodooman.com/miscimages/VJr_mod_PCB_1.jpg


And here's a photo, courtesy of Dennis Cronin's web page (http://www.valvejunior.com/), showing where the grounding jumper is installed on the back of the PCB:

http://duhvoodooman.com/miscimages/jumper.jpg


Since we're limited to 4 images per posting here, and I have one more, I'll close this posting and continue in the next one....

[duhvoodooman]

Lastly, here's the finished product, all reassembled and ready to run. The only giveaway that the amp has been modded is the brightness toggle at the left side of the front panel:

http://duhvoodooman.com/miscimages/mod_VJr.jpg


And what did this all accomplish, you ask?

Well, a whole bunch, actually. The ambient hum is completely gone, to my ear. The volume-dependent buzz is much reduced, and far less "buzzy" in character now. More of a true hum, and no worse than I get with my Delta Blues cranked up. I don't even notice it until the volume is at 3/4, and I rarely play there, anyway! So the four hum fixes have definitely done their job.

As for brightening the tone, mission accomplished there, too. The resistor changes made a difference, and the new brightness switch takes it the rest of the way there. With the switch on to engage the tone cap, the top-end brightens up nicely. Makes a noticeable difference with both single poles & humbuckers. I like it so much I'll probably just leave it "on" most of the time. I'll post an audio clip or two in the coming days, so y'all can hear how she sounds.

So there you have it, Fretters. If anyone has a question, drop me a PM or ask it here. And I've got all the part numbers I ordered from Mouser.com, if you want to try any of these mods on your own Valve Junior! If an electronics ignoramus like me can do it (with some soldering help!), anyone can!

[Nelskie]

DVM - Again, fantastic post. Shows what a little ambition and "can-do" attitude can accomplish. That brightness switch, though, really has me curious soundwise. I'll look forward to hearing your sound clips, so make sure you have one with / without it engaged.

And . . . although you did list the individual parts in each of the descriptions, it'd be really nice to have a working list - just so one can get all the parts at once, and not forget anything. And since you already have the parts #'s - even better.

BTW - what are you running for tubes in your Jr. these days . . . NOS? I have an "inkling" to try out one of those Groove Tubes Mullard re-issues in my amp, just to see what happens. ;)

[Bloozcat]

WOW!

Now that's some great information. You layed it out beautifully, with great detail. I've never had any real electronics training, so I'm still a little "fuzzy" (how about, in a fog?) when it comes to reading schematics. Your photos with the accompanying explanations and details are first rate. I don't think I'd have any problem following those instructions to completion!

Great work!

[Bloozcat]

And . . . although you did list the individual parts in each of the descriptions, it'd be really nice to have a working list - just so one can get all the parts at once, and not forget anything. And since you already have the parts #'s - even better.

I believe they call that a BOM which is an ancronym for "Bill Of Materials." At least that's what I've seen it called over on the 18watt.com amp-builders site.

[duhvoodooman]

DVM - Again, fantastic post. Shows what a little ambition and "can-do" attitude can accomplish.
Aw, shucks! (blushes) Thanks, Nelsk. It was fun, for a tinkerer like me.


That brightness switch, though, really has me curious soundwise. I'll look forward to hearing your sound clips, so make sure you have one with / without it engaged.
Exactly my intention. Hopefully, it comes through clearly in a recorded clip. It's not a "night & day" difference, by any means--just a nice additional "sparkle" at the top-end that I find pleasing.


...although you did list the individual parts in each of the descriptions, it'd be really nice to have a working list - just so one can get all the parts at once, and not forget anything. And since you already have the parts #'s - even better.
A BOM, indeed (that Bloozcat is pretty sharp with his engineering terms!). Your wish is my command, sahib. The attached ZIP archive contains both an Excel spreadsheet and also a screenshot GIF, for folks who don't have Excel:

263


BTW - what are you running for tubes in your Jr. these days . . . NOS? I have an "inkling" to try out one of those Groove Tubes Mullard re-issues in my amp, just to see what happens. ;)
I have a pair of JJ's in there. A standard ECC83S for the preamp, and a "graded" EL84 for early breakup. I couldn't see putting $50 worth of NOS tubes into an amp I paid $90 for, and which is going to be used primarily by my son to torture his Squier Tele....

[Nelskie]

Thanks for the BOM, Voodoo. Your Junior project looks like a great Saturday afternoon DIY activity, as well as the perfect way to get my feet wet in the wild, wooly world of "home-grown amp modding" . :eek:

I'll watch this thread for the sound clips.

[duhvoodooman]

A couple of additional comments on the BOM items:

You'll notice that the resistors needed for the R1/R2 changes aren't listed. That's because I got them right here at work for nothing. One 1 M and one 22K. Same with the 1/4 female spade connectors I used, and the wire.
I listed three different tone caps in the BOM--50, 68 and 100pf ratings. You'll only need one. I'd skip the 50 completely, and go with the 68 by default, or the 100 if you really like a bright, jangly tone. On the other hand, they're only about 70 cents each, so it wouldn't hurt to get a couple.

[duhvoodooman]

Here's a couple of audio clips I recorded with my Valve Jr's new brightness switch off and on. Clip descriptions:

#1 - My Epi LP with tone controls at midpoint. The same basic riff is played twice, first with the brightness off, then with it on. The first pair is recorded with the p'up selector in the middle position, i.e. with both p'ups. The second pair is the bridge p'up only.

#2 - My Strat, with the treble controls dimed, to accentuate the highs. The first pair is recorded from the neck p'up and the second pair, from the bridge. Again, the first of each pair of riffs is with the brightness off, and the second with it on.


Clip #1 (http://duhvoodooman.com/audio_clips/lp_bright_off_on.mp3)

Clip #2 (http://duhvoodooman.com/audio_clips/strat_bright_off_on.mp3)

With the 68pf tone cap, the effect is fairly subtle, but clearly audible. If you were looking for more brightness than this, the 100pf tone cap would be the way to go. I may change it at some point, just to hear the difference for myself. But it sounds just about right to me now, so maybe not! ;) :D :DR

[Nelskie]

DVM - You're right, the difference with the brightness switch "on" is clearly audible - and yeah, it does sound good. Out of all the clips you've posted, the tone that really stands out to me is your Strat with the neck p'up, with the brightness switch "on". Very tasty! Those new Texas Specials sound like they're doin' the trick for you.

After all those mods, pictures, posts, and now . . . clips, I'd say it's time for you to go get a cold one, grab the Strat, plug in to the Jr., and enjoy the fruits of your labor. Nice job, my friend! ;)

I'm waaaaaayyyyy stoked to dig into my Jr.!!!

[duhvoodooman]

Thanks, Nelsk. It being Saturday and all, I'll probably do exactly that at some point! :DR

Also, notice what you didn't hear in the "dead air" spots between the clips--hum. At the volume setting I was using, there's no audible hum or buzz at all. :D

[Nelskie]

DVM - Went to Mouser.com this morning, and ordered the parts for my Valve Jr.'s "Voodoo Mod". If they're here at Ice Station Zebra (aka NoDak) by the latter part of next week, I should be knee-deep in creamy, hum-free Class A mojo come next weekend!! Provided that I don't electrocute myself! :D

[Tone2TheBone]

Very good job you did on this mod Bob. I'm glad the pups are working out for you too.

[Nelskie]

Yes, you've read that right. Dr. Ampenstein has found yet another way to turn our favorite little tube amp into an even bigger tone monster! And this by adding more front-end gain. It may just be the Wonka Golden Ticket to true low-watt, Class A nirvana. Here's the link:

http://members.optusnet.com.au/eyes.only/vj_mods_3/vj.htm

Voodoo - whaddya' think? Could you pull this off? ;)

[duhvoodooman]

No, thanks! I mean, I'm sure it's doable, but if I need more gain control, I'll just hookup the old Tonebone to it! A lot less trouble.... :DR

[duhvoodooman]

I have taken all the Valve Jr. mod information from my posts above and integrated them--plus some additional detail and links--into a webpage on my site. Makes it a little easier to follow than scrolling down through a series of posts. You can get to it here:

http://duhvoodooman.com/VJr/VJr_mods.htm

[Nelskie]

No, thanks! I mean, I'm sure it's doable, but if I need more gain control, I'll just hookup the old Tonebone to it! A lot less trouble.... :DR
Yeah, I agree. The Junior doesn't really need another tube. But I think you could count the one in the Tonebone as #3, right?!! ;)

[Nelskie]

For those of you who’ve read the duhvoodooman’s fantastic Valve Jr. Mod mod page, and heard the sound clips, you already have a pretty good idea as to the potential of the Epiphone Valve Jr. amp. There’ve been numerous comparisons of the Junior to other low-watt wunderkind – but apples to apples, it would be safe to say that the Epi is undoubtedly playing the role of Rocky Balboa vs. either of any of its higher-priced competition.

I’ve been using my Valve Jr. amp in semi-stock form (new tubes & speaker) for about (10) months, and in that time, have come to appreciate the genuine nuances of its tone. Still, every time I plugged in, I couldn’t help but wonder whether or not there were gains to be made with the implementation a little electronic wizardry.

Using the DVM’s mod page as my base, I purchased the required parts for my project from Mouser.com, and they arrived shortly thereafter. Mouser is a good place to get quality electrical components at a reasonable price. Shipping was quick, and the parts were well-packed. A trip to Home Depot for a battery-powered soldering pen, and I was ready to turn my Junior to a bona-fide tone machine.

After a few test-soldering runs, I felt I was ready to make it happen. My first undertaking was to solder a small jumper wire on the bottom of the board. And so, I patiently applied my limited soldering skills to this task. After nearly an hour and a half, and still no success, I came to the frustrating conclusion that the task of modding an amp was probably best left to people who are more adept to this kind of thing - - not to mention to someone with at least modest soldering skills – which I obviously did not have. Even though I was a bit let-down about not being able to execute the mods myself, I did give it a shot - - which in my book counts for something. My point here is this: even basic mods do require some skill and knowledge. If you don’t feel that you can take the job from start to finish – let a professional do it. It’ll save you a lot of headaches – and of course, a lot of frustration.

Now that that the mods are finally done, I can definitely say that the amp sounds even better - and I really liked the way it sounded before. Here is my take on some of the key aspects of the Voodoo Project:

1.) Hum – Virtually non-existent with a humbucker-equipped guitar. Much, much better with a single-coil equipped guitar – most particularly at higher volume levels. Now, we must understand that “hum” is inherent to the Class A amp design, irregardless of what Obi Wan Kenobi says at Amptone.com. So, unless you want to fork over another $700 - $1,000 for a real boutique number, any advances you can make in this territory with the Valve Jr. should be measured with that in mind. These mods do a very good job at reducing ambient hum, which in turn, allows more of that great Class A tone to come through.
2.) Brightness switch – In my opinion, this is the mod that really pushed this project over the top. Having the option to brighten up the tone on this amp is like giving your Strat (5) more p’up positions. Or, for you Lesmeisters – (3) more p’up positions. Currently, I am running a Weber Alnico 8S speaker in my Jr., and the bright switch really takes full advantage of the “chimey” vintage-type tones that are the trademark of this type of speaker. I used the 68 pf cap, and would agree with DVM’s observations that this is the perfect medium. However, your own preferences may require more, or less, in this dept.
3.) Response – As I’ve mentioned on my previous posts, the Valve Jr. is an extremely responsive amp. The smallest variances in pick attack and guitar vol / tone adjustments are transposed by the amp into magical tonal mojo. The new mods have most definitely enhanced the responsiveness of the Junior – particularly in the depth and definition of the tone. As I played my Korean Strat through the amp, I marveled at how the notes “jumped” out of the speaker. Major chords had a resounding “fullness”, and increased sustain – both with and without the brightness switch engaged.
4.) Volume – I wasn’t expecting any increases in this area – and yet, the amp now seems to be louder. Part of this could be attributable to the J & J tubes I am currently running, which break up just a bit earlier than the stock Sovteks did, and have a “grittier” attitude. It may also coincide with the characteristics of response, as are noted above.
5.) Overall Tone – Reducing the ambient noise has had a significant effect on the overall tonality of the Valve Jr. It is almost like I am hearing this amp again for the first time. And now being face-to-face with that fact, it is somewhat perplexing that the design engineers at Epiphone weren’t able to come to this same conclusion. But, as we’ve touched on many times here at Fret.Net, even simple improvements can have a dramatic effect on overall tone. This project is a perfect illustration of that fact.

These recent mods cost me $73 - $23 for the parts, and $50 for the labor. Added to the $165 I had into the unit prior to this ($119 for the amp; $26 for the tubes, $30 for the speaker), this brings the total of outlay for my Valve Jr., in its current form – to $228.00. In my book, its been money well-spent. And despite its diminutive size, the little amp produces some very BIG tone.

So what else is there to compare the Valve Jr. to tone-wise? Well, for starters, you may be able to procure a 1968 or later Fender Champ for around $300 - $350, or slightly more depending on condition. A Fender Blues Jr. will push you into the $400 range. The Crate Palomino and V-5 Series are two other low-watt Class A amps that will fit the bill nicely, and are both in that $350 - $400 range as well. I’ve played all of these amps, and would now put my Valve Jr. in the same league as these amps. Bottom line – there’s probably a Benjamin and some change to get you to that next level in the low-watt Class A feeder chain.

As for comparisons to real boutique numbers – there are none. This is a mass-produced Chinese amplifier, constructed with cheaply-made components, and stricken a bevy of design deficiencies. But with the right approach, and a little good ol’ American know-how, there are some fantastic tones to be had.

In closing, I would give the Epiphone Jr. “Voodoo” Mod Project two solid thumbs up. These are all cost-effective mods make a huge difference to an amp that already rocks right out of the box. If you have a jones for a low-watt Class A amp, I’d say that you should at least consider the Valve Jr. as a starting point, and then seriously consider employing these mods to your amp. You can always move up into a vintage, or higher end Class A model. The Jr., in stock or modified form, will allow you to explore the gamut of fabulous tones that this amp design is famous for - at a cost that won’t leave you gasping for air.

My next plan for my Valve Jr. is to mate it’s vastly improved tone with an Electro Harmonix Holy Grail reverb pedal. The results of that endeavor may just require me to change my nickname to “Indiana”. ;)

[Justaguyin_nc]

Ok you guys are starting to get to me...(GAS).. I have a 5 watt tube amp.. Harmony H410 with a little 8in speaker and Tremelo built in... but all this talk about this Epi got me wondering... My problem is..I never can find sound clips on how this amp without and with mods sounds.. I am wondering if I would just be wasting money by already have'n one very similar? can anyone point me to some great clips on these amps?

Whats the comparison to other 5 watt amps? I know gibson has theirs at around $500.. so price there leaves them out... You can buy a vintage amp on ebay from makers such as Harmony for $100-$200? Crate has their V-Series58 around $250 with better celetion speaker etc which would call for no modding (seems like a neat little amp) and older version 508 (don't like the looks)... another words...is this amp really worth doing all the mods to if others are available? (don't wanna burn my fingers with a soldering gun..:) )

Is all this excitement for this $140.00 combo or $100 head really worth it? .... Hmmm... GAS ... GAS...

[Nelskie]

Is all this excitement for this $140.00 combo or $100 head really worth it? .... Hmmm... GAS ... GAS...
Yes, Justa, the excitement about these amps is indeed real - as if you'd need me to tell you that. Go to Harmony Central, or just Google "Valve Jr." - you'll find hundreds of sites & reviews that are clamoring about this little tube-powered gem

Unfortunately, there aren't many before / after mod sound clips out there, so deciding to incorporate the mods may seem like a shot in the dark. However, I will be honest in telling you that the combo mods listed on DVM's page do, in fact, accomplish what they say they will - they lower the ambient noise, and brighten the overall tone. The new head version, as I understand it, has noise reduction circuitry, so you wouldn't have to do anything there - except maybe change out the stock tubes.

I did find a site that had some clips of a Valve Jr. head running through various cabinets. Check them out here:

http://www.instituteofnoise.com/L6/ampclips.asp#Epiphone

Sometimes "pulling the trigger" is the hardest part about getting a new piece of gear. You can try to "justa-fy" it many different ways, but it all boils down to wanting it, and then getting it. I think once you have a chance to play one of these amps at length, you'll know first-hand what all the fuss is about. This is one hot little rig. ;)

[Robert]

I am also very interested in this head. I think I'm going for it!

[Nelskie]

Man Robert, you line that Valve Jr. head up with a nice cab / speaker, and you'll have yourself one smokin' hot tube combo. I run my Jr. through the 112E ext. cab (equipped with an Eminence 12" Swamp Thang) that I use with my Classic 30, and that rig totally rocks! If you swap out the stock Sovteks for some choice tubes - you'll be set! :cool:

[Robert]

Yeah, Nelskie, it should be fun with a good cab! It seems a good cab costs a bit. The one I'm looking at is the Avatar 1x12 - http://www.steamcomusic.com/avatar/documents/g112.html would be towards 400 bucks shipped and with taxes. Not's so bad I guess, it seems like a great cab from the reviews.

Hey, the local store has this Hartke 4x12 - http://www.samsontech.com/products/productpage.cfm?prodID=1740&brandID=3
Review here - http://reviews.harmony-central.com/reviews/Guitar+Amp/product/Hartke/GH410+Cabinet/10/1
Seems cool! But it takes up some space of course...

Uhoh, the review was for the 4x10, which seems to be discontinued... the 4x12 doesn't get the same review.

[Nelskie]

Yeah Robert - I saw your post on these Avatar cabs a week or so ago. If I didn't already have that Classic 112E, as well as the Tech 21 Power Engine, there'd definintely be an Avatar cab in my arsenal.

As for the Valve Jr. / Avatar 12" combo - man, I bet that would just smoke! You'd need to have a fire extinguisher nearby for sure! If that's what you're thinking, I'd be PM'ing the Bloozcat & DVM for some tube recommendations.

All-in-all, I think you'd be really happy with the Valve Jr. head. It takes to pedals really well, has awesome tone, can drive anything you put behind it, and best of all - ALL tube power. ;)

[Robert]

Yeah, I'm interested to see how different it is from my Hellhound. The Hellhound can produce some tasty tube tones in the family of Blackface and in between Marshall and Vox.

[duhvoodooman]

but all this talk about this Epi got me wondering... My problem is..I never can find sound clips on how this amp without and with mods sounds.. I am wondering if I would just be wasting money by already have'n one very similar? can anyone point me to some great clips on these amps?
Here's a couple of quick clips, one with my Strat and the other with my Dot. Starts clean, gets dirty (courtesy of my Tonebone).


Strat thru modded Valve Jr. (http://duhvoodooman.com/audio_clips/VJr_Strat_sample.mp3)

Dot thru modded Valve Jr. (http://duhvoodooman.com/audio_clips/VJr_Dot_sample.mp3)

[Justaguyin_nc]

Here's a couple of quick clips, one with my Strat and the other with my Dot. Starts clean, gets dirty (courtesy of my Tonebone).


Thanks alot DVM... the DOT had a real nice ZZtop sound to it comming from the Valve Junior... Ok ok Im hooked.. Maybe a Epi Head and some cab.. SoCal 4x12 looks cool for $299.00... :) Would like to hear all of LaGrange thru it..:)

On a side note: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7krcTLWDpo has Brooks and Dunn teamed with ZZTOP... watching at the end I think Ronnie Dunn wet himself, he had such fun playing with the boys from texas... great vid if you got the time..wa wa wa.. Brooks plays a good Harmonica..

:R :R

[oldguy]

Here is quick demo I made of the v.jr. head I have through an Avatar 2x12 cab. A rush job recorded w/ a cheapo audio technica pro 3L mike, complete with me tapping my foot at one point. Didn't even know I did it till I played it back. Anyway, hope it is helpful. The little amp is bone stock. Added some effects later in the clip. If a good picker "ahem" got hold of one of these, it could really sing.
http://savefile.com/projects/864564

By the way, does anyone know an easy way to convert WAV file to Mp3 to send so it loads fast. Right now I convert wav to mp3 as I burn to CD, but can't do it without burning up a disc. Suggestions? Thanks for any help.
Glenn

[Justaguyin_nc]

WOW... Very nice ~~OLDGUY~~ exactly what I wanted to hear out of a stock Valve Junior Head! now about that Avatar cab..open back or closed? which speakers? and thank you..:)

As for conversion...What software do you track with? You can use Lame with Audacity for complete free setup which works pretty well.. reference post: http://www.thefret.net/showthread.php?t=470&highlight=audacity

[oldguy]

Thanks, Justa. I'll check out the link. As for the Avatar cab, it's a "semi-open" back w/ one Celestion vintage 30 and one G12'H which is supposed to let the vintage break up early enough and the G12 carry the low end "oomph".
I record through an older Boss BR 532 digital recorder, convert the "BR" file to a "WAV" file with the Boss software, but wanted a way to convert the wav to mp3 in order to save space when I download. I'll sure check out the audacity and lame links, I think that would help me alot. I'm not very computer smart, but, man, I love to play!:D
Glenn Hughes
gen-u-wine Mizzurah hillbilly:D :eek:

[Nelskie]

... but all this talk about this Epi got me wondering... My problem is..I never can find sound clips on how this amp without and with mods sounds..
Justa - I came across some Valve Jr. head clips over at the Harmony Central forum, and thought you might be interested in hearing them. Here's the link:

http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1255784&highlight=valve+clips

And some others over at the Institute of Noise, a Line 6 site. As luck would have it, the guitar used on all of these clips is a Squier 51! Coincidence . . . or not . . . perhaps fate is telling you something? I'll also forewarn you that the the dude playing on these clips can really bring it, too. Here's the link:

http://www.instituteofnoise.com/L6/ampclips.asp#Epiphone

(*in a voice of foregone conclusion*) Let me know when you order one. ;)

[Nelskie]

I was going to post this over on the Valve Jr. sound clips page, but since it didn't have anything to to with sound clips, I decided that I'd include it here, as there may be some folks working their way through this thread who it would benefit.

One of the things many people are saying about the Valve Jr. is that its tone is a bit on the "dark side". Not to fear Young Skywalkers - there are plenty of ways to brighten up the already great Class A tone - one of which is tube selection. I'd sent an e-mail to Eurotubes yesterday to get some input on what they would recommend for my soon-to-be-arriving Valve Jr. head. Here's what Jay at Eurotubes had to say:


We've been retubing a lot of these lately and a JJ EL84 in a grade anywhere between a #30 to a #36 are quite nice with the #36 getting a bit less headroom and the #30 staying cleaner.

For the front end you can either use the JJ ECC83S or the ECC803S. I do not recommend the ECC803S for the VJ combo amps but they are just fine for the head version. The ECC803S is a lower gain tube with a real thick mid and a little brighter high end so if you choose to use one of these I would recommend a matched triode ECC803S that is at 90+ in gain.

If you want to maintain the amount of gain the amp has now then you can use a matched triode ECC83S that is between 105 to 110 in gain.
So, as you can see - even between amps that are similar, as in the Valve Jr. combo & head, small differences in tube type can have a significant effect on the overall tone structure of the sound. Again, it's something to keep in mind for any amp - not just the Valve Jr.'s.

The speaker, of course, will also have a dramatic effect on overall tonal response. Different sizes, magnet types, magnet weights, cone material, and power handling capabilities will all have unique and individual tonal characteristics. If you're using the head version, the type of cabinet you use will also have a big effect on how the tone of the amp is projected.

Speakers & tubes are fairly simple change-out mods that have immediately noticeable tonal benefits. Moving into some of the more advanced mods, like installing a brighness switch, or adding components / circuitry to reduce ambient noise, will improve overall amp response / efficiency, as well as enhance tone. Obviously, these mods will involve more time & monetary committment. But if you're willing to go the extra mile, I will definitely say that there are some pretty impressive rewards as far as guitar tone is concerned. My guess is that tone2thebone's Valve Jr. sound clips post will eventually acquire enough hard audio evidence to promote these findings. ;)

[tot_Ou_tard]

I was on the Mercury Magnetics Valve Junior Mod kit page

http://www.mercurymagnetics.com/pages/specials/ValveJrPjt/EVJ-01.htm

and found this little nugget that allows you to tell whether your Valve Jr Combo has the same wiring (complete with DC filaments) as the head.

I called Epiphone about 6 months ago asking if there was a way to tell
the difference (eg a serial number), both types were in stores at that time, & he said that there was no way to know.

...his pants are now on fire.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are two versions of the Valve Jr. Combo in circulation. We call the first "Version 1" and the latest "Version 2." There are several minor external case differences but the Version 1 circuit board is a lot different than Version 2 units.

The easy way to identify if you have a Version 2 unit is by first 4 digits of the Junior's serial number are the date code (MMYY). Version 2 Junior's have a date code of "0106" (January 2006) or later. Version 2 models also have a slightly larger Epiphone logo with added black trim. The Valve Jr. Head's circuit board is the same as the Combo's Version 2.

[warren0728]

i have the version 1....someday i am going to mod it (or sell it)

ww

[Justaguyin_nc]

Well, You guys finally got to me... I have yet broke on the Vox... but for this little change and all the good reviews...
I already had the Harmony 5 watter, but it was (notice I said was) a combo and I would have to wire it to go with my Avatar cab...
soooo... At $99.99 from Musciansfriend with free shipping I figured just the outputs to 4/8/16 was worth something.
I have some extra tubes already I can try playing with when it gets here. And it will look good sitting along side that little Crate Powerblock.

Question: Whats a good cheap A-B switch to go from one amp to the other into the cabinet?

[warren0728]

congrats on the new amp.....i think when the new cab they are building for the valve jr amp is available i might get rid of my original version one combo and pick up the head and cab....then get a guytronix gilmore jr kit and run that through the cab as well!

ww

[oldguy]

Congrats, Justa, bet you're gonna like it.:) Gets some good OD sounds cranked, lots of fun to swap tubes and hear the changes, too.

If you want tons of info on the V.Jr. you can go here... modding and some generalizations, but good reading IMO.

http://www.18watt.com/index.php

more info there than anyplace I've seen yet.
I'm gonna put a new Hammond output transformer in mine (the 125DSE).
I'll let you know how it turns out.
The stock transformer is 7.5Kohms impedance
The Hammond is twice the size and wires to 5K imp.
An EL84's optimum is 5.2K. Twice the iron/winding within .2K imp. should be better.
We'll see if it really makes a difference or is just a waste of $40. :D

[Spudman]

Question: Whats a good cheap A-B switch to go from one amp to the other into the cabinet?

I'm not sure what you are looking for in an A/B switch, but I have these two Behringers and they work for switching between guitars or into different amps. If you need one to handle the signal from 2 different amps into a single speaker cabinet then you'll have to look at Radial Engineering Headbone. (they ain't cheap) http://www.tonebone.com/tb-headbone-ss.htm

Otherwise...

http://www.music123.com/Behringer-Dual-AB-2-Channel-Footswitch-i156798.music

http://www.music123.com/Behringer-Guitar-Amp-Selector-i156780.music

[Justaguyin_nc]

If you need one to handle the signal from 2 different amps into a single speaker cabinet then you'll have to look at Radial Engineering Headbone. (they ain't cheap) http://www.tonebone.com/tb-headbone-ss.htm


Thanks for the reply Spuds...

My goodness... thats twice as much as either amp.. lol..

I guess I can always get up and plug it in and out.. sheesh... that's the only thing out there ?

[LagrangeCalvert]

avatar cabs my A**. sorry but theese guys really push my buttons. I too am a tone snob, and own a pair of valve JR's that are modded. One is a rhythm head and the other is a lead head playing onto a 4x8 cab that was once a 50$ guitar research cab but I rebuilt the inside and loaded it with celestion super 8s. I worked at a place where kitchen and other cabs were built and took my old avatar there (the 2x12) and had the head carpenter/builder dissect it. It was built by someone who didn't care about quality. Sorry, I know they sound good but to me its a ripoff. there speakers are the only saving quality. IMHO the best HAND BUILT CAB are these www.earcandycabs.com

If your serious about your tone check em out. I sold my Avatar in hopes of getting one of theese, but my mother had cancer and I quit my job to take care of her. I want one SOOOOOOO bad.

You can pick the woods you wanted built with, and the speakers. Check out the info on theese.

[Spudman]

+1 on the Ear Candy. That's what I've been saying all along. They really put some thinking into what they do, and they are really nice guys too. I ordered some connectors from them and they sent extra...just because.:)

[LagrangeCalvert]

http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=74510961&albumID=0&imageID=1787222

my two VJ's before I built my speaker cab. I have an A/B/Y switch hooked up to go between channels and to have both on at the same time. One is setup for rhythm the other for lead. Different tubes and resistors and other things.

[tot_Ou_tard]

If your serious about your tone check em out. I sold my Avatar in hopes of getting one of theese, but my mother had cancer and I quit my job to take care of her. I want one SOOOOOOO bad.

Whoa, Joshua. You can talk to us about the dealing with your Mom's cancer if you wish. If you'd rather not, we'd understand that too. Good luck Dude!

[LagrangeCalvert]

nah, Im good. I just get a little caught up in the moment. Im real passionate about music. I didn't mean to get sappy.

[duhvoodooman]

A bit of an update on my Valve Junior combo:

In recent months, I hadn't been playing it much because even with the bright switch mod I did, I found it quite dark sounding, with little top-end definition & sizzle. Over the Thanksgiving holiday, I wired a switch into the output jack, and hooked up the 8 ohm output from the output transformer along with the 4 ohm output that was already wired in. (The stock OT in the original Valve Junior combo came with both 4 and 8 ohm outputs, but the latter wasn't hooked up.) So now I can switch between the two output impedances and run either of my two 8 ohm cabs with it (a 1x12 and a 2x12). Well, after a bit of playing through those, it's become obvious that my problem wasn't with the amp, but the little 8" speaker that comes in it. The amp really comes alive through either of those two cabs I have--a huge difference. I'd read comments from several sources that the stock speaker in the VJr combo was a very decent sounding 8" speaker, and that replacing it with a more expensive one didn't make that much improvement in tone. Well, either (1) those people are idiots, (2) the speaker in mine is a lousy or defective one, or (3) 8" speakers suck in general, because the amp sounds 100% better through either of the two cabs.

So if there any of you Valve Jr. combo owners out there who haven't tried using an external speaker cabinet with it, by all means, give this a try. And if anyone needs directions on how to wire in a toggle switch with the 4 and 8 ohm outputs, let me know and I'll send you a diagram.

I may try another 8" speaker in the combo itself, but I don't want to spend much. Maybe a relatively inexpensive Weber or something....

[WackyT]

I put a Jensen MOD 10" 70 Watt in my Pignose G40V amp, and I love the sound. Good and cheap speakers. Their 8" 20 Watt goes for less than $20.

[tunghaichuan]

I may try another 8" speaker in the combo itself, but I don't want to spend much. Maybe a relatively inexpensive Weber or something....

I've never heard an 8" speaker I liked. They all sound tiny, weak and constricted to me.

Having said that, I do have a pair of 8" Webers I plan to put in a 2x8" cab.

I run my VJ through a 1x12" ported cab loaded with either a Celestion or a Carvin/Eminence Celestion knock off.

tung

[Guitar Gal]

DVM,

I have a EVJ combo (version 2) and have not done any mods on it ..... yet. Been looking through the Epi forum and other places to get ideas on mods and think I might start with a new OT. I was looking at getting the Hammond 125ESE to replace the stock OT. From what I have read, this mod makes the most difference and is definitely worth it. Do you still have the original OT or did you replace it? I looked at those 8" weber speakers too.....looks like they are a decent price.

GG

[tunghaichuan]

I have a EVJ combo (version 2) and have not done any mods on it ..... yet. Been looking through the Epi forum and other places to get ideas on mods and think I might start with a new OT. I was looking at getting the Hammond 125ESE to replace the stock OT. From what I have read, this mod makes the most difference and is definitely worth it. Do you still have the original OT or did you replace it? I looked at those 8" weber speakers too.....looks like they are a decent price.
GG

I'm not duhvoodooman, but I've done quite a few mods to Valve Juniors.

The Hammond 125ESE will make a big difference. Physically, it is about 3-4x as big as the stock OT. So you'll get a better low end response. The stock speaker may not be able to produce it however, YMMV. The stock OT has a primary impedence of 7.5K, which is too high for the EL84 which wants to "see" about 5K. The other advantage is that Hammond can be configured for 5K.

If you do replace the stock OT, save it. It works well with 6V6 and similar tubes (6AQ5, 6CM6, 7408, 5871, etc.) I put one in a Champ circuit and it sounds better than when used with an EL84.

Once you change the stock OT, your voltages may go up. You might want to mod the power supply and rebias the power amp so that your amp doesn't eat tubes:

http://www.diycustomamps.com/valvejunior.htm#vjbias

BTW, be careful when soldering the PCB in the Ver2 amp, they are very fragile: the traces will lift if you apply to much heat with the soldering iron.

If you want to mod the preamp section, I can make some recommendations.

One last thing: if you have a DMM that only measures up to 300v DC, you could fry your meter measuring some of the voltages in the VJ.

tung

[duhvoodooman]

....I do have a pair of 8" Webers I plan to put in a 2x8" cab.
Which model 8" Weber, Tung? They make a bazillion of them!


....I was looking at getting the Hammond 125ESE to replace the stock OT. From what I have read, this mod makes the most difference and is definitely worth it. Do you still have the original OT or did you replace it? I looked at those 8" weber speakers too.....looks like they are a decent price.
No, I didn't replace the stock OT in mine. Haven't decided if I will or not. Between an OT and a new speaker, I'd be sinking another $60 - $70 in the amp, and I only paid $92 for it on eBay! Gotta think about this....

BTW, which Weber model were you looking at, GG?

[tunghaichuan]

Which model 8" Weber, Tung? They make a bazillion of them!


The magnet says C8SS-8. Know anything about them? I got them about 4-5 years ago.

tung

[duhvoodooman]

The magnet says C8SS-8. Know anything about them? I got them about 4-5 years ago.
Does THIS (https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/csig8s.htm) look like them? Closest thing I can find on the Weber site to that "C8SS-8" designation, ostensibly denoting Ceramic 8" Signature S model, 8 ohm version.

Two models that piqued my interest were these:


Chicago Vintage Series Ceramic (https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/cvc8.htm)

Signature Series AlNiCo (https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/asig8s.htm)

Comments/advice? An alnico speaker for $31.50 looks very tempting!

EDIT: Here's another alnico for $35 that looks interesting:


British Series "Blue Pup" AlNiCo (https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/apup8.htm)

[tunghaichuan]

Does THIS (https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/csig8s.htm) look like them? Closest thing I can find on the Weber site to that "C8SS-8" designation, ostensibly denoting Ceramic 8" Signature S model, 8 ohm version.

Two models that piqued my interest were these:


Chicago Vintage Series Ceramic (https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/cvc8.htm)

Signature Series AlNiCo (https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/asig8s.htm)

Comments/advice? An alnico speaker for $31.50 looks very tempting!

I think those are the ones. I believe I bought mine on a close out a few years ago.

I'm not the right guy to ask about 8" speakers, I'm an 8" speaker hater :rotflmao:

Seriously though, the alnico speaker probably would sound better than most of them. Although one caveat is that the EL84 is a bright tube. Since an 8" speaker is going to accentuate the highs, and I tend to think of alnico speakers as bright, you may have a painfully bright amp with alnico. OTOH, a dark speaker might sound muddy.

EDIT: I would tend to think that the Blue Pup would be painfully bright with an EL84.

The best advice I can give you is to call or email Ted Weber and ask him what he thinks.

tung

[WackyT]

The Weber C8SS is the old part # for the signature series ribbed cone ceramic model.
http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Alt/alt.guitar.amps/2006-04/msg02917.html

What's the sound difference between a ceramic and alnico magnetted speaker?

[tunghaichuan]

The Weber C8SS is the old part # for the signature series ribbed cone ceramic model.
http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Alt/alt.guitar.amps/2006-04/msg02917.html

What's the sound difference between a ceramic and alnico magnetted speaker?

My experience is that alnico speakers are brighter and compress when pushed. They sound good Fender Tweed circuits because as those old 50s Fenders tend to be dark/middy. Ceramic speakers sound more middy to me and more agressive when pushed.

Of course there are exceptions. The Celestion G12T-75 (ceramic) sounds painfully bright to me and lacks mids. A lot of metal guys like them to get the "scooped mids" death metal sound.

tung

[Guitar Gal]

Tung,

Thanks for the info. Will keep this in mind when I start the mods. Have not done anything yet.....still in the planning stages.

DVM,

I was looking at the same weber 8" that you were looking at: https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/asig8s.htm Thought the $31.50 was not a bad price.


:Dude:

GG

[duhvoodooman]

Well, at Tung's excellent suggestion, I have an e-mail in to Ted Weber asking if there's a particular model that he recommends for the Valve Junior combo. Alnico may well be the way to go, since Tung's description of the old Tweeds as being "dark/middy" is a pretty good characterization of how the VJr tends to sound, IMO. Could definitely use a shot of brightness. But we'll see what Ted has to say....

[duhvoodooman]

I did a little recording with my Valve Junior last night, to show the difference between playing through the stock speaker and running it through a cabinet instead. The cab I used is a 1x12 that I built with an AB Custom Audio cabinet and a WGS Veteran 30 speaker. Here are two clips, one with my Strat (neck p'up, clean, using the Behringer clean boost pedal I recently bought for a little extra oomph), and the other with my LP (bridge, with distortion/sustain courtesy of a juiced-up Rat clone pedal I built). For both clips, the same selection is played through twice, first through the 1x12 cabinet and then through the VJr's stock 8" speaker. You can hear pretty clearly how much more open the cab sounds, with better top-end definition and clarity. The stock speaker is definitely darker sounding, and has that boxy quality, esp. evident with the LP clip. BTW, I had that brightness switch I installed in my VJr turned on thoughout the recording of these clips; otherwise, the tone would be noticeably darker/duller.

For the Strat demo, I used the intro to a Joe Bonamassa tune that I've been learning (originally a BB King tune). Still some false notes and flubs in there, but I don't claim to be any "Smokin' Joe"! It's a work in progress. For the LP clip, I just used one of my favorite old Jeff Beck/Yardbirds riffs--good for practicing my legato playing.

Here are the clips:

[Adrian30]

What an mazing difference!

[Tone2TheBone]

I agree. The amp sounds much better with the mods and the ext. speaker. Way better than stock. Good job Voo.

[sunvalleylaw]

Nice demos! I guess I really am a strat guy. I loved that sound. Boy, you sure can't tell who your biggest influence as a player is! ;-) Bonamassa with a distinct SRV flavor I say. Nice!

I did not mind the cab with the strat sample as much, though the cab did sound better. The LP sample definitely called out for the cab. Interesting, I misread your post before listening, and thought the second run through was going to be the cab. I was thinking to myself, "Why do I like the first run through better?" Duh!

[Guitar Gal]

Thanks for psoting the sound demos DVM :rockon: Can definitely hear the difference between the stock speaker and the cabinet.

GG

[tot_Ou_tard]

Huge diff Vood!

I agree with Sun, love that strat playing.

[M29]

Some nice playing there duhvoodooman:AOK: They are pretty restricted with the smaller speaker. I have run mine through 2/12's I can't imagine how nice it would sound with a 4x12 Marshall cab. I love my VJ, I have finally stopped moddin and buttoned it up so I can play it for a while:rockon:

M29

[LagrangeCalvert]

I have a 4x8 closed back cab that is loaded with celestion super 8's and that thing screams....sounds really good IMHO. The speakers were bought for 15 dollars for all four of them cause the guy wanted them gone from his store... their 45 dollars retail. That with some birch to line the cheap OSB cab and other tidbits to make it solid (this was made by guitar research and I have had it for a year now) I have it wired up to run as two 2x8's OR a 4x12. So I can use it as a 60 watt cab or two 30 watt cabs. I have it setup to run both my Valve Jr's....one has been modded to be a rhythm head....the other is a "lead" head with a tweed style tone knob (the knob is also a gain push/pull switch) and this setup is more than loud enough. ALSO I use an A/B/Y switch that has two inputs as well - since I use two guitars - so I don't have to unplug from the switch. With both amps kicked in you can get some serious sound AND a very complex tone that is very rich in harmonics and its in icepick at all. FWIW you can get some serious kick out of those 8 inch speakers via that closed back design!


I think the VJ and the other 5+/- watt tube economy amps are a steal. I giged with this rig a ton and took it to open jams...it was a head turner AND a great conversation starter.


To all the other VJ modders....we should start a fretnet VJ modders club.

You have to have pics to prove it and we can have meetings and all that jazz......


or we can just say "YAY" for VJ's and get over it ;)

Josh

[oldguy]

To all the other VJ modders....we should start a fretnet VJ modders club.

You have to have pics to prove it and we can have meetings and all that jazz......


or we can just say "YAY" for VJ's and get over it ;)

Josh

We kinda/sorta have one, Josh, it's just so disorganized under mods you gotta hunt each thread. Voodoo did the first, I think. I did some tube swapping, then the Hammond OT, then a little more, then a lot more.
I run mine through a 2x12 Avatar cab w/ Celestions. There are some pics, links, etc. in this old thread. Near the end are some sounds of the ValveJr. after I modded it, clean and cranked, and OD added w/ Vood's ZYS.:AOK: :rockon: :D


http://www.thefret.net/showthread.php?t=4711

And some pics, w/ my notes, fwiw...:pancake
The pics were mods I was doing at the time, the notes were to help other people, if they chose to mod their VJ head.


http://www.box.net/files#2:f:0:1:f_62191474
http://www.box.net/files#2:f:0:1:f_63056692
http://www.box.net/files#2:f:0:1:f_63057048

[tunghaichuan]

I have a 4x8 closed back cab that is loaded with celestion super 8's and that thing screams....sounds really good IMHO.... FWIW you can get some serious kick out of those 8 inch speakers via that closed back design!


Since you mentioned this, it occured to me that I could make a detuned 2x8" cabinet. Basically it is a cabinet that has holes for 4x8" speakers, but only two are filled. The other two holes act as ports. The cabinet has to be closed back of course.

I have Kevin O'Connor's book on the subject (http://www.londonpower.com/books/spkr.htm).



I think the VJ and the other 5+/- watt tube economy amps are a steal. I giged with this rig a ton and took it to open jams...it was a head turner AND a great conversation starter.


There really isn't much to them, electronically speaking. The hardest part for me was getting a decent looking cabinet and chassis. The VJ solved that for a lot of people. I'm also looking to get a Blackheart head after the first of the year. With the TMB EQ, it will be more flexible for modding.



To all the other VJ modders....we should start a fretnet VJ modders club.

You have to have pics to prove it and we can have meetings and all that jazz......


Most of you have probably seen this before, but here are my contribution. I haven't put up pics of my stock modded head though:

http://www.diycustomamps.com/valvejunior.htm

The Voodoo Baby VJ is probably one of the best sounding VJs on the planet, even if I do say so myself :D

I bet I have less than $50 into the scratch-built VJ circuit I did.

tung

[tot_Ou_tard]

Vood,

Were those clips done at equivalent decibels? I haven't considered running my Fender Champion 600 though a cab because I was concerned that it would be too loud.

But if it would open up the tone at a decent volume, then .... :whatever: .

I might like to change the transformer on the 600, but I know nothing about them other than Mercury has an expensive kit for the 600. Is there a Hammond I could use?

[duhvoodooman]

Vood,

Were those clips done at equivalent decibels? I haven't considered running my Fender Champion 600 though a cab because I was concerned that it would be too loud.
Very close to the same volume settings for each pair. I was controlling final volume with the Strat's vol knob, and I had to back off less than one click with the cab to keep the volume essentially equal to the stock speaker. For the LP clip, I didn't touch the volume between the two rifs, but keep in mind that the signal was going through a distortion pedal, and the clipping stage tends to equalize the output volume pretty effectively.

Bottom line, the 1x12 cab is a bit louder than the stock speaker, and a 2x12 cab is louder yet. But the difference is in reasonable increments, not big, nasty quantum jumps.

P.S. I've never used or even heard the impact of one, but those pricey Mercury kits look like a big ol' ripoff to me....

[tunghaichuan]

P.S. I've never used or even heard the impact of one, but those pricey Mercury kits look like a big ol' ripoff to me....

There was a thread about this on the SEwatt.com forum. The consensus was that the only worthwhile part of the MM kit was the OT. The stock PT in the VJ is more than adequate. And the VJ doesn't really need a choke. Chokes help reduce power supply ripple, but the same effect can be had by replacing the first cap in the power supply with a 100uF/400v electrolytic. I replaced the first two caps in mine with 130uF/400v caps, but then again I like overkill :D

So really, the people buying the MM kit are paying about $250 too much when all they really need is a $40-$50 Hammond OT.

tung

[tunghaichuan]

Vood,
I might like to change the transformer on the 600, but I know nothing about them other than Mercury has an expensive kit for the 600. Is there a Hammond I could use?

Since the Champion 600 is tweaked version of the 5F1 Champ, you could use Hammond's 125CSE, 125DSE, or 125ESE. Any of those would work, but you'd get the best bass response with the 125ESE.

I've used the 125ESE in about 5 or so Tweed Champ/Princeton circuits and it works well. Vintage Champs/Princetons had an OT with about 7.6k for the primary. I'm not sure what the primary is on the Champion 600 though. When using the Hammonds, the closest you can get is 5K, but in my experience it sounds great. The 125ESE is huge though, it might be hard to shoehorn into the chassis.

Edit: the best place to buy Hammond iron right now is www.radiodaze.com

Heck, by all acounts the Champion 600 OT sounds pretty good, you may not even need to change it.

tung

[tot_Ou_tard]

Since the Champion 600 is tweaked version of the 5F1 Champ, you could use Hammond's 125CSE, 125DSE, or 125ESE. Any of those would work, but you'd get the best bass response with the 125ESE.

I've used the 125ESE in about 5 or so Tweed Champ/Princeton circuits and it works well. Vintage Champs/Princetons had an OT with about 7.6k for the primary. I'm not sure what the primary is on the Champion 600 though. When using the Hammonds, the closest you can get is 5K, but in my experience it sounds great. The 125ESE is huge though, it might be hard to shoehorn into the chassis.

Edit: the best place to buy Hammond iron right now is www.radiodaze.com (http://www.radiodaze.com)

Heck, by all acounts the Champion 600 OT sounds pretty good, you may not even need to change it.

tung
Wow! Thanks Tung!

I love my 600, I only thought that if it could sound *even better* for not much outlay ;).

Thanks for the cab info Vood!

[duhvoodooman]

Back to the 8" speaker discussion....

There's some great amp speaker info available at the South Valley Vintage Amps website, with some specific recommendations (http://www.svvintageamps.com/speaker.php#question2) on 8" speakers. I'm seriously looking at that Jensen ceramic C8R model for upgrading my Valve Jr. Available for under $30. I just can't justify dropping a $65 alnico P8R into that cheap little amp.

Check out the rest of that page--there's a wealth of information about amp speakers there! A great resource....

[Guitar Gal]

DVM...

Thanks for the link to that website and those speakers. :Dude:

That 8" Jensen ceramic is even cheaper.......err.......more economically priced than the 8" Weber. Like you, I don't want to spend a lot of $$ on my VJ, but this speaker may be a possibility. :D

GG

[duhvoodooman]

That 8" Jensen ceramic is even cheaper.......err.......more economically priced than the 8" Weber. Like you, I don't want to spend a lot of $$ on my VJ, but this speaker may be a possibility.
Well, I'll let you know how it sounds, 'cuz I ordered a C8R this afternoon, along with a Jensen C12N, which is the upgraded speaker that comes in the special lacquered tweed NOS version (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Fender-Blues-Jr.-NOS-1x12-Guitar-Combo-Amp-Lacquer-Tweed-with-Jensen-Speakers?sku=483711) of the Blues Junior. Everything I read says it really improves the Blues Junior's tone.

I ended up getting both from the Tube Depot (http://www.tubedepot.com/sp-jen-c8r.html), because (1) the prices were a bit better, (2) shipping from Memphis TN was faster & substantially cheaper, and (3) they take PayPal, which I prefer over using a credit card. But if I was closer to the West Coast, I'd use SV Vintage Amps, for sure.

[mrmudcat]

Great stuff as always voodoo.Im really digging and enjoying reading your posts and threads!!!:poke: Ive been a lil quiet just observing watching and learning:master:

[Kazz]

Love your modding page Voodoo.....clips are very nice and appreciated that you used the same riff in all recordings so you get a discernable difference. That being said...I love the tone in both recordings...and I prefer the sound of the first section of both recordings....more bell like I guess is how I describe what I hear.

[duhvoodooman]

OK, here are those same two sound clips I linked before, only now they've got a sample with my brand new Jensen C8R speaker mounted in the Valve Jr. combo tacked on to the end. So now, each clip has the same riff 3 times--first through my 1x12 cab, then the stock Valve Jr. speaker, and lastly through the Jensen C8R. I tried to set up the C8R amp & recording conditions to be as close to the original recording as possible.

Keep in mind that the Jensen speaker quite literally had 2 or 3 minutes of playing through it when I did this, so it is still very tight. But you can immediately hear that it has a more open sound, with a much livelier top end and better clarity all around. Though it's hard to tell with these particular riffs, the bottom is noticeably more taut and articulate, too. Overall, I'd say I still like the tone of the 1x12 cab the best (no surprise, really), but the Jensen is a significant upgrade over the stock speaker, and I expect it will get nothing but better as it breaks in. Quite a nice upgrade for a mere $28 + shipping....

[Tone2TheBone]

Bob I agree that I also like the first take on the 1x12. I like the tone balance there. What was the Jensen running through? To me the Jensen has a upper mid shift which is still an interesting tone.

[Guitar Gal]

Thanks for the sound clip comparisons DVM :AOK:

Although I have to agree with others that the 1X12 cab sounds the best, that Jensen 8" seems to be a nice upgrade for the VJ combo. Think I'll have to add that to my upgrade list along with a new OT :R

GG

[duhvoodooman]

Although I have to agree with others that the 1X12 cab sounds the best, that Jensen 8" seems to be a nice upgrade for the VJ combo. Think I'll have to add that to my upgrade list along with a new OT
Yeah, I would definitely agree that, if you have a good cab already or if you can afford the added expense of getting one, your best choice is the Valve Jr. head. But if you already have a VJr combo and want to use it as one (i.e. with the integrated speaker), then this Jensen speaker offers a nice tonal benefit over the stock speaker for not-a-lot of cash. It gives the VJr kind of a sparkly Fender-ish top-end. For anyone interested in buying a C8R or just checking it out, HERE (http://www.tubedepot.com/sp-jen-c8r.html) is the link to where I got mine.

[tunghaichuan]

Found this site today:

http://gearscore.com/b/boxx/knowledgebase.asp?iid=131&cat=15

Lots of good information there. Although, personally, I feel the BitMo mods and the Mercury Magnetics kit are a waste of money.

tung

[F_BSurfer]

Well started some mods on my VJR version1 yesterday just some simple stuff first replaced volume pot,input jack, added a 100 uf filter cap added jumper on pcb to shore up grounding.
Fired it up and just when I thought I knew a little bit about tube amps this gave me a wake up!!! Hum is so loud it will run you out of the room, thats with the pot down. Doubled and tripled check all I did that is fine as far solder joints , do think it is a grounding issue can hold onto chassis and stops?

[tunghaichuan]

I believe the hum problem is caused by a poorly laid out PCB. The heater traces are too close to some of the traces carrying the signal. Check out Duhvoodooman's mod D:

http://duhvoodooman.com/VJr/VJr_mods.htm

Except that I would use a 10,000uF/25v cap. I like to use Nichicon caps, they seem to be smaller when compared to the same value/rating of caps from other manufacturers.

tung


Well started some mods on my VJR version1 yesterday just some simple stuff first replaced volume pot,input jack, added a 100 uf filter cap added jumper on pcb to shore up grounding.
Fired it up and just when I thought I knew a little bit about tube amps this gave me a wake up!!! Hum is so loud it will run you out of the room, thats with the pot down. Doubled and tripled check all I did that is fine as far solder joints , do think it is a grounding issue can hold onto chassis and stops?

[Duff]

I am debating building a solid pine, stained or oiled, expanded metal grill covered with cloth from walmart, trimed in front with small strips of pine screwed on holding the cloth in place. Big, closed back, lots of room for resonation, no port. Could put in a port or design to remove a 4 inch board from the back for open back sound.

Might sound good. Only can estimate the sound and am not a sound engineer.

Also, the cost of a nice speaker, 12 inch, and materials might be as much or close to a new vj 12 inch cabinet, 16 ohms.

If I made one it would be an 8 ohm so I could use it with my HRD.

Any ideas? Would the solid wood cabinet sound better than the epi 16 ohm one?

Thanks in advance,

Duffy

[oldguy]

I am debating building a solid pine, stained or oiled, expanded metal grill covered with cloth from walmart, trimed in front with small strips of pine screwed on holding the cloth in place. Big, closed back, lots of room for resonation, no port. Could put in a port or design to remove a 4 inch board from the back for open back sound.

Might sound good. Only can estimate the sound and am not a sound engineer.

Also, the cost of a nice speaker, 12 inch, and materials might be as much or close to a new vj 12 inch cabinet, 16 ohms.

If I made one it would be an 8 ohm so I could use it with my HRD.

Any ideas? Would the solid wood cabinet sound better than the epi 16 ohm one?

Thanks in advance,

Duffy

Duffy,
Lopoline is having a sale.....

http://www.lopoline.com/home.html

[F_BSurfer]

Yes I check out DVM's page pile of good info in one place

I haven't made it as far as the bridge rectifier yet
I did something to create what i have going on now just wish I would have done one mod at time and test live and learn!!!!

[tunghaichuan]

Yes I check out DVM's page pile of good info in one place

I haven't made it as far as the bridge rectifier yet
I did something to create what i have going on now just wish I would have done one mod at time and test live and learn!!!!

When you get ready to do the unregulated DC heater mod, PM me and I'll dig out the Mouser part numbers. When I did the Voodoo Baby VJ rebuild (http://www.diycustomamps.com/valvejunior.htm#vjrebuild), I used an eyelet board from turretboards.com and had problems with heater hum. I ended up building a small board to house the DC rectifier components.

tung

[Duff]

I went out and purchased a VJ Cab at GC for 129. It sounds good. I'll have to break it in.

The Jensen P12N in my Tweed HRD at 8 ohms seems to sound louder and better, especially when pushed to distortion. It gives a nice smooth distortion with lots of growl.

The VJ cab pushed to distortion gives a more rough growling sound. Maybe it was just the guitar I was using. I'll experiment more. Plus the overall volume is not as high as with the 8 ohm I don't think. But this could be a good thing because you can get that distortion at a lower level. Maybe my guitar processor pedal will smooth out the distortion or breaking it in might help.

Any ideas?

The VJ cab doesn't sound bad by any means, don't get me wrong. Maybe I just spoiled myself playing the head through that two hundred dollar Jensen speaker in the HRD Tweed.

Duffy

[Guitar Gal]

Well....I finally finished my mods that I had planned for my Epi VJ. I ended up doing three things: 1) replaced the stock speaker with a Jensen C8R, 2) sent an e-mail to Bob at Eurotubes and got recommendations to replace the stock tubes, and 3) replaced the stock OT with a Hammond 125ESE.

I did each mod and played the VJ before going on to the next one. I started with replacing the speaker. This seemed to make a HUGE tonal improvement overall. Seemed to open up the VJ and the notes rang out clearer. Sounded less "muddy" to my ears.

Next, I replaced the stock tubes with JJ tubes from Eurotubes. I put in an EL84 and an ECC83S. I wanted to have some clean headroom so Bob at Eurotubes made suggestions on the grade and gain of the tubes. This mod also made a noticeable difference. Notes were more defined and sharper. I could really hear all my mistakes now :messedup:

Lastly, I replaced the stock OT with the Hammond 125ESE. The Hammond is HUGE compared to the stock OT.....weighs about 4lbs. This mod seemed to just be the icing on the cake. Seemed to "warm" the VJ .... gave it some good bass, mids, and highs....no harsh tones at all.

Overall, each mod added something that the stock VJ was missing IMO. Biggest change seemed to be the speaker change.....but maybe because I did this one first, I noticed it more :confused:

In the end, I spent almost (not quite) as much on these mods as what the VJ cost me initially.......but I now have a sweet sounding little 5 watt tube amp that makes me wanna play more :rockon:

Priceless :master:

GG

[mrmudcat]

Nice nice....A guitar gal who mods her own amps:master: ........I swear If I weren't married........................;) :saw: ^ ^
GG MM

[M29]

Whow GG:rockon: You even got the ESE and not the DSE OT. Awesome, I kind of wished I had done that. Not that it is a big deal, but it just might be and I will never know.

I too have spent more money then I wanted on modding that little bugger but in the end I am very pleased with the amp and I get a tremendous amount of enjoyment out of it. I have not replaced the tubes yet and I am expecting another huge improvement. Just not enough money, too much outgo and not enough income lately:D

Your new avatar is awesome:rockon:

M29

[warren0728]

Nice nice....A guitar gal who mods her own amps........I swear If I weren't married........................;)
i was thinking the same thing....then i remembered i'm not married....florida is really nice this time of year....do you like pancakes? :pancake: :rotflmao: ;)

ww

[oldguy]

:AOK: :AOK: :AOK: Way to go, GG!!:D
A lot of people have done the Hammond + tube upgrade to the V.Jr. head and were done, nothing more needed. Sounds like the speaker upgrade was the other mod needed to round out your V.J. Kudos to you for "just doing it", as Nike would say.

[sunvalleylaw]

i was thinking the same thing....then i remembered i'm not married....florida is really nice this time of year....do you like pancakes? :pancake: :rotflmao:

ww


RUUUUNNN AWAYYYY, RUUNN AWAYYYYYYY! :poke: ;) :D



Cool about the mods GG! Clips now?! :)

[just strum]

GG,

That's it, I'm packing up all my equipment and I'm driving down - be there in about two hours.

Damn, I am impressed. Your comments about your ability are certainly understated. Between your equipment and your understated ability, I think you have come a long way since we met over at the "W".

:AOK: :AOK: :AOK:

[tot_Ou_tard]

So many mods for the VJ, I've put NOS tubes in my Fender Champion 600 & it sounds great to me.

No mud, the only problem is the bass at high gain, but since I like the edge of beakup much, much more than high gain it isn't an issue for me.

Someday I might replace the transformer & get a cab...or just get a SWART & be done with it.

[warren0728]

RUUUUNNN AWAYYYY, RUUNN AWAYYYYYYY!
them lawyer types sure are smart!! :beer:

ww :greenguitar:

[tunghaichuan]

As luck would have it, I got a chance to physically inspect on of those Champion 600 amps at GC yesterday. I didn't get a chance to plug in though.

One thing that struck me about that amp was how small the OT is. If I were to get one, I would look at putting in a different OT. Maybe a Hammond 125CSE or a Fender Champ 12 replacement OT. I don't think a 125ESE would fit in there.

Of course the limiting factor of that amp is ths small speaker, you're never going to get thunderous bass out of that amp, no matter what OT you use.

That amp sure is a cute little rascall, though :D

tung


So many mods for the VJ, I've put NOS tubes in my Fender Champion 600 & it sounds great to me.

No mud, the only problem is the bass at high gain, but since I like the edge of beakup much, much more than high gain it isn't an issue for me.

Someday I might replace the transformer & get a cab...or just get a SWART & be done with it.

[duhvoodooman]

GG,

Very cool! :dude:

I did the JJ tube swap first, but I had Eurotubes send me two EL-84's, with one rated for early break-up and the other for max. headroom, so I could play around some. Did the Jensen C8R speaker upgrade just recently, as you're aware. In between, I did several mods (http://www.duhvoodooman.com/VJr/VJr_mods.htm) on the PCB to clean up the v.1 combo hum/noise issues and add a "bright" switch. I assume you must have one of the v.2 combos, since you haven't mentioned any noise issues?

Well, I suppose I ought to just bite the bullet and finish the job with this OT upgrade that so many people seem to be doing & liking the results. Where did you get yours? Radiodaze.com, maybe? Tung recommends them for Hammond transformers.

Speaking of Tung, maybe he'll pop back in to this thread and explain why that 15W Hammond OT is needed in a 5W amp.....

[tunghaichuan]

Duhvoodooman asked me a question about VJ OTs in a PM this morning. Here is my response:

I have actually tried both the 125ESE and 125CSE in my VJ head.

The 125CSE is a great improvement over the stock version 2, 7.5k primary VJ OT. Better bass, smoother, not as much harsh, nasty treble as the stock OT. The 125ESE provides even more: even better bass, really smooth response, and *no* harsh nasty treble. I found that the amp needed a conjunctive filter (http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~ehn/ax84/#filter) to smooth out the high end when using either the stock OT or 125CSE. The CF is not needed at all when using a 125ESE.

Forgot to add: the newest version 3 of the VJs have a 5K primary OT which is about what the EL84 wants to see. A 125CSE or 125DSE isn't much of an improvement over the the ver3 stock OT. You have to move up the 125ESE for maximum sonic benefit.

Furthermore, the best sounding OT I have used in a VJ is the Heyboer from Doberman Amps (http://www.dobermanamps.com/). The amp I rebuilt (http://www.diycustomamps.com/valvejunior.htm#vjrebuild) using that OT is probably the best sounding VJ on the planet. The downside is that the Doberman'/Heyboer OT is huge: it barely fit the chassis. That OT is also grossly over spec'd for 5w amp use: it is rated for 160mA through the core. Practically, you can use that OT for two 6L6s or EL34s in parallel SE operation. The 125ESE is only spec'd for 80mA, although I've put 100mA through it with no problems. Hammonds are notoriously under rated.

I think it has to do with core size: bigger core = better bass.

So, althought the 125ESE looks grossly overated on paper, it sounds better than the 125CSE which is closer in ratings to the requirements of the circuit.

tung

[Guitar Gal]

Thanks for all of your kind words :beer:

The VJ mods were fun to do and it was exciting to hear the changes as I went along.

DVM.....yes, my VJ is a version 2 so no hum issue. I ended up getting the OT from here: http://www.tubesandmore.com/ because they were offering free shipping on orders over $99.00.....so I got the OT, the Jensen speaker and a couple of other little do-dads to get the free shipping. BTW....everything was packed very well, they shipped it out the day I ordered it, and they also threw in a free Jensen t-shirt that I did not expect :dude: Gotta love FREE stuff... I have no affiliation with tubes and more....yadda, yadda, yadda......just a satisfied customer. I believe that Radiodaze has better prices on the OT though.

GG

[Guitar Gal]

Whow GG:rockon: You even got the ESE and not the DSE OT. Awesome, I kind of wished I had done that. Just not enough money, too much outgo and not enough income lately:D

M29

Yeah.....I know THAT feeling :thwap:

GG

[tunghaichuan]

Yeah.....I know THAT feeling :thwap:

GG

As the bluegrass song says: "I ain't broke, just badly bent." :D

tung

[duhvoodooman]

Well, I decided I might as well finish what I started so long ago. Odered a Hammond 125ESE output transformer from Radiodaze.com (http://www.radiodaze.com) during my lunch hour. Best price I've been able to find, at $36.59....

[marnold]

As the bluegrass song says: "I ain't broke, just badly bent." :D
Or, to quote Red Green, "If it ain't broke, you aren't trying."

[Guitar Gal]

Well, I decided I might as well finish what I started so long ago. Odered a Hammond 125ESE output transformer from Radiodaze.com (http://www.radiodaze.com) during my lunch hour. Best price I've been able to find, at $36.59....

Alright :AOK:

Interested to hear your impressions once you change out the OT.

GG

[M29]

Man I think I paid about 45 for my DSE. You are going to love that transformer duhvoodooman:rockon:

M29

[F_BSurfer]

Not much cheaper I think Angela Instruments is the cheapest on Hammonds
http://www.angela.com

[tunghaichuan]

Not much cheaper I think Angela Instruments is the cheapest on Hammonds
http://www.angela.com

Ordering from Steve at Angela can be hit and miss. I've ordered a few transformers from him and have never had a problem. I have heard of others having problems with him, though. Thre have been stories floating around about what a real jacka$$ he can be since when I first started reading amp building sites on the 'Net. The key is just to order and not expect any kind of tech support. He states this clearly on his site, but some people still try to test this. I have heard of other saying Steve went off on them for no reason.

Caveat emptor.

tung

[Bloozcat]

Steve at Angela Instruments is a little like "The Soup Nazi", in that he expects you to know exactly what you want when you call, and that you know exactly what to do with it when you get it....without any help. No questions, no substitutions, no "dumb" questions ("dumb" as determined by Steve). He's not much for conversation either. But, on the positive side, he has items that you can't find elsewhere, and some pretty good prices on some things. He sells the Hammond 125ESE currently for $36.50, which is just $4-$5 less than I paid for mine from him several months ago. Bought some excellent Riken/Ohm resistors from him that weren't available anywhere else to my knowledge as well.

When I got the transformer from him, I noticed that something else was rattling around in the box. I dug around in the packing material and found a womans ring. It didn't appear to be too be too valuable, but I thought it might have sentimental value to whomever it was who lost it. I mailed the ring back to Angela Instruments along with a note explaining how I found it. Turns out, the ring belongs to Angela, Steve and Susan's daughter, and she was thrilled to get it back. Will this perhaps soften Steve's demeanor next time I call in an order? I don't hold out much hope of that, but his wife Susan sent me a very nice letter thanking me for my consideration. That was worth it to me....:AOK:

Now, if only I can quit getting side tracked with work, other projects, the holidays, and whatever other "excuse" I can come up with, maybe I'll actually get that 125ESE installed in my VJ....:o

[duhvoodooman]

I received the Hammond 125ESE output transformer from Radiodaze.com late last week, and installed it over the weekend. It dwarfs the puny little VJr stock OT! Very easy installation. Other than disconnecting the stock OT, running the wires & soldering them in, the only other thing required is to drill an additional hole through the chassis for mounting the OT, due to its larger footprint.

I don't have before/after clips for this change, but I can tell you that the change was really quite noticeable. The amps overall tone sounds clearer & crisper to me, and the bottom end is significantly louder and better defined. This is particularly evident when I run the amp through one of my cabs, since the 12" speakers really show off the better bass response. While this is not as cheap of an upgrade as some of the other VJr mods (the OT came to about $46, including NY sales tax and shipping), it does have a nice tonal benefit. :AOK:

Geez, BC, I'm glad I didn't deal w/ that guy at Angela Instruments! Sounds like one false move and it's "No tranny for you!!" :rotflmao:

[Bloozcat]

Geez, BC, I'm glad I didn't deal w/ that guy at Angela Instruments! Sounds like one false move and it's "No tranny for you!!" :rotflmao:

No tranny for you. Come back...six months! :rotflmao:

Really though, if you know what you need and don't waste any time when ordering, Steve's ok. He seems like a "time is money, so don't waste my time", kind of guy.

Glad you liked the tranny, DVM. Your description matches what I've heard from others who've installed one in a VJ.

[hindmarsh]

OK. This thread has been very interesting reading. My son and I are new to guitar and I've been wanting to get a good amp and I think I've been sold on the Valve Jr instead of a modeling amp or shelling out the money for a VOX or something else along those lines.

For those who have had a bunch of experience with this line and the mods, if you were going to buy another one today, would you go with the combo and make the mods or would you go with the head and cab set, or both? The combo being a more portable practice amp and the cabinet giving better quality when at home?

On another note, what would be a good first pedal set to go with it?

Thanks!

[F_BSurfer]

If i were to do do it all over again I would still buy the combo still can plug into a cab if I want a bigger sound

[duhvoodooman]

For those who have had a bunch of experience with this line and the mods, if you were going to buy another one today, would you go with the combo and make the mods or would you go with the head and cab set, or both? The combo being a more portable practice amp and the cabinet giving better quality when at home?

On another note, what would be a good first pedal set to go with it?
Because I've since acquired a couple of speaker cabs, I'd probably opt for the head. There are plenty of enhancements to tone & gain available for the head, as well, if you find that the stock sound doesn't scratch all your itches.

You should also take a look at the new Blackheart amps, since they play in this same arena. Check this forum for more on those. They have a tone stack, which the VJr's lack.

Re: pedals, well that really depends upon what you like to play. I consider a reverb pedal a requirement with these, since they don't have one built in. I'd also put a good wah, overdrive, heavier distortion and a delay pedal on my "must have" list, but that's just me....

[Bloozcat]

And for those who might like to dabble at modding, or might want a hand wired circuit, or just a simplified modular approach, check this site out (Click on Valve Jr. Stuff):
http://www.turretboards.com/

[tot_Ou_tard]

Cool Vood! I'm definitely gonna replace the tranny on my Champion 600, but I'm gonna wait until I buy a cab. That'll be probably a year or so out.

Hindmarsh, I'd look into the Blackheart amps. I'd get one of those over a VJ.

If you are new to guitars, don't listen to Vood about *must have* pedals ;).

Don't get any pedals until you identify a need.

No, scratch that: maybe get the Bad Monkey, it's cheap & will give you decent overdrive.

[duhvoodooman]

If you are new to guitars, don't listen to Vood about *must have* pedals ;).

Don't get any pedals until you identify a need.

No, scratch that: maybe get the Bad Monkey, it's cheap & will give you decent overdrive.
Regrettably, this is probably good advice. I don't seem to have a lot of , er, self control when it comes to pedals. However, a decent overdrive pedal is considered by saner folks than me to be a pretty basic accessory for a tube amp. And I'll stick by the reverb pedal recommendation, because a little 'verb really adds a dimension of space/openness to an amp that doesn't have it "on board", whether Epiphone, Blackheart or another brand. And don't buy a real cheap one, 'cuz that's exactly how they sound. My DigiTech DigiVerb does a great job--good reverb sounds and several to choose from. Not too expensive, either, particularly used ones on eBay.

Whaddya think, Tot? I trimmed it down to two! Am I not a bastion of restraint?? :AOK:

[just strum]

Whaddya think, Tot? I trimmed it down to two! Am I not a bastion of restraint?? :AOK:

Are you twitching?

Edit: ok, you recommend an overdrive pedal for a tube amp, what about the ad30vt? One pedal, which one would it be?

[tot_Ou_tard]

Regrettably, this is probably good advice. I don't seem to have a lot of , er, self control when it comes to pedals. However, a decent overdrive pedal is considered by saner folks than me to be a pretty basic accessory for a tube amp. And I'll stick by the reverb pedal recommendation, because a little 'verb really adds a dimension of space/openness to an amp that doesn't have it "on board", whether Epiphone, Blackheart or another brand. And don't buy a real cheap one, 'cuz that's exactly how they sound. My DigiTech DigiVerb does a great job--good reverb sounds and several to choose from. Not too expensive, either, particularly used ones on eBay.

Whaddya think, Tot? I trimmed it down to two! Am I not a bastion of restraint?? :AOK:
Very good Vood! :AOK:

Maybe I should get me a 'verb. I haven't felt the need for one, maybe I'm wrong ;).

I do suggest, however, that wet newbie wanking won't sound any better than dry newbie wanking :D.

[just strum]

I do suggest, however, that wet newbie wanking won't sound any better than dry newbie wanking :D.

:rotflmao: that didn't take long.

[duhvoodooman]

Actually, the same thing--a good overdrive pedal--but for a somewhat different reason. The amp models on the righthand side of the AD30VT's dial cover heavier distortion quite well, but I want to have something to "dirty up" the cleaner amp models, particularly the Boutique Clean and the Black 2x12. That's the best way to get a nice blues tone with those models, IMO. Also useful with some of the other "left-side" amp models like the Tweed 4x10, AC30TB, and even the UK'70s where you might want to run edge-of-breakup on their gain settings and then push it over the top with an OD pedal for soloing.

There are a zillion good OD pedals out there. The Bad Monkey gets a lot of press here because it has a pretty broad tonal range, sounds great and is very reasonably priced at $50 new, and can occasionally be found for even less. But there are so many more excellent ones. Of course,the best is probably the ZYS, but I hear that's temporarily out of production. ;) :D

Re: that reverb pedal, even us hacks can use a little variety in our wanking.... :rockon: (Take note of which emoticon I didn't use!)

[marnold]

Actually, the same thing--a good overdrive pedal--but for a somewhat different reason. The amp models on the righthand side of the AD30VT's dial cover heavier distortion quite well, but I want to have something to "dirty up" the cleaner amp models, particularly the Boutique Clean and the Black 2x12. That's the best way to get a nice blues tone with those models, IMO. Also useful with some of the other "left-side" amp models like the Tweed 4x10, AC30TB, and even the UK'70s where you might want to run edge-of-breakup on their gain settings and then push it over the top with an OD pedal for soloing.
Yes! To DVM you listen!

I like the bluesy overdrive I can get from my TO800 through the Blackface model better than cranking the gain on the AD30VT alone. For that I'll keep the gain on the amp at about 1:00 and set my TO800's drive at about 9:00, the level at noon, and the tone at about 1:00-2:00. That gives single coils some respectable SRV-esque umpf.

As I've mentioned many times before, I use my TO800 to give the UK70s model the extra cajones that it otherwise lacks. The gain is dimed on the AD30VT. My TO800 is set for virtually no drive, but the level is dimed and the tone is at about 1:00. Basically I'm using it as a non-clean boost (by "non-clean" I mean it is also boosting upper mids slightly).

[hindmarsh]

Alas, timing is everything. So, I go out to look at the Bad Monkey and what do I see? A buy 2 get 1 free coupon staring back at me.:D

After reading the coupon I understand the task at hand. a) The pedals must be on the approved list and the freebie has to be equal to or less than the lowest purchased pedal by category level. b) the purchase must be done by Jan 15th! Gotta work fast under pressure.

Wanting to maximize the freebie I ended up buying the DigiVerb and the DigiDelay so I could get the SynthWah as the freebie and claim a 45% savings. Then I made a second purchase for the Bad Monkey.

So, instead of spending $50 I spent $250, just to get a free $90 pedal - :thwap:

Thanks for suggestions and explantion DVM, when do you hear the ZYS is going to be back in production?:whatever:

[duhvoodooman]

Thanks for suggestions and explantion DVM, when do you hear the ZYS is going to be back in production? :whatever:
Well, I didn't have any immediate "production runs" planned anyway, but I couldn't even if I wanted to, at the moment. The ZYS is built on the BYOC "Screamer" clone PCB, and Keith Vonderhulls (Mr. BYOC) has stopped selling them separately from his kits. So instead of buying an $8 PCB, I'd have to get the full kit for $90. :eek: I don't think so!! So I'd have to locate a new PCB source and make the corresponding design changes to the ZYS before I could make any more....

[tot_Ou_tard]

So, instead of spending $50 I spent $250, just to get a free $90 pedal - :thwap:


Such are the ways of GAS :D.

Enjoy!!

[Bloozcat]

Regrettably, this is probably good advice. I don't seem to have a lot of , er, self control when it comes to pedals. However, a decent overdrive pedal is considered by saner folks than me to be a pretty basic accessory for a tube amp. And I'll stick by the reverb pedal recommendation, because a little 'verb really adds a dimension of space/openness to an amp that doesn't have it "on board", whether Epiphone, Blackheart or another brand. And don't buy a real cheap one, 'cuz that's exactly how they sound. My DigiTech DigiVerb does a great job--good reverb sounds and several to choose from. Not too expensive, either, particularly used ones on eBay.

Whaddya think, Tot? I trimmed it down to two! Am I not a bastion of restraint?? :AOK:

Well, look at it this way, DVM. It's not a lack of self control that inspires you to add more pedals to your collection, it's the quest for knowledge and self satisfaction that drives you. After all, you build your own pedals now, and even sell some of them. When you think of some of the things that people throw money away on as "entertainment", what you're doing looks pretty good.

And BTW ,DVM, if you use this line of reasoning with your wife, please don't use my name in the discussion, ok? :D

[F_BSurfer]

Don't know if you have came across this site DVM a little more than you were paying but I think they have your pcb

http://www.generalguitargadgets.com/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=1

[duhvoodooman]

Don't know if you have came across this site DVM a little more than you were paying but I think they have your pcb

http://www.generalguitargadgets.com/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=1
Yep, familiar with them. May very well try their PCB, since they provide full project documentation for the TS clone on their site. Thanks, FBS! :AOK:

[Guitar Gal]

I received the Hammond 125ESE output transformer from Radiodaze.com late last week, and installed it over the weekend. It dwarfs the puny little VJr stock OT! Very easy installation. Other than disconnecting the stock OT, running the wires & soldering them in, the only other thing required is to drill an additional hole through the chassis for mounting the OT, due to its larger footprint.

I don't have before/after clips for this change, but I can tell you that the change was really quite noticeable. The amps overall tone sounds clearer & crisper to me, and the bottom end is significantly louder and better defined. This is particularly evident when I run the amp through one of my cabs, since the 12" speakers really show off the better bass response.

Glad to hear that you like the new OT also DVM :dude: I personally think it was $$ well spent ........ can't put a price on sweet tone!

:rockon:

GG

[just strum]

Yes! To DVM you listen!

I like the bluesy overdrive I can get from my TO800 through the Blackface model better than cranking the gain on the AD30VT alone. For that I'll keep the gain on the amp at about 1:00 and set my TO800's drive at about 9:00, the level at noon, and the tone at about 1:00-2:00. That gives single coils some respectable SRV-esque umpf.

As I've mentioned many times before, I use my TO800 to give the UK70s model the extra cajones that it otherwise lacks. The gain is dimed on the AD30VT. My TO800 is set for virtually no drive, but the level is dimed and the tone is at about 1:00. Basically I'm using it as a non-clean boost (by "non-clean" I mean it is also boosting upper mids slightly).

Do you have any idea as to how this compares to a Bad Monkey? I see they are about 1/2 the price as the BM, but I was curious on how the two compare.

checked out e-bay the other day and could have had a new Bad Monkey for $40, free shipping (BuyItNow) - but drag your feet...

[marnold]

Do you have any idea as to how this compares to a Bad Monkey? I see they are about 1/2 the price as the BM, but I was curious on how the two compare.

checked out e-bay the other day and could have had a new Bad Monkey for $40, free shipping (BuyItNow) - but drag your feet...
I've never seen a Bad Monkey. I'm sure it has more solid construction than my TO800. IIRC, the Monkey also has two tone controls instead of one on the TO800. I posted a link to a review about a year ago where someone compared a TO800 very favorably to a TS-808. Sounded good to me!

[duhvoodooman]

For the sake of completeness, I've updated my Valve Jr. Mods webpage (http://www.duhvoodooman.com/VJr/VJr_mods.htm) with a description of the last 3 mods/upgrades I did to my "vers. 1" VJr combo:


Speaker upgrade to Jensen C8R
Switchable 4 ohm/8 ohm output
Output transformer upgrade
The new info is down near the bottom of the page.

While doing the OT swap, I came across a very useful document HERE (http://www.s2amps.com/docs/vj_kit_inst.pdf). These are the detailed instructions, with a lot of good technical explanation, that came with a commercial VJr upgrade kit from S2 Amps. Though the kit is no longer sold, the information is detailed enough that you could easily buy your own components and do many of these upgrades yourself. I see a couple in there that I may yet do on my own VJr (it never ends!)....

[Bloozcat]

While doing the OT swap, I came across a very useful document HERE (http://www.s2amps.com/docs/vj_kit_inst.pdf). These are the detailed instructions, with a lot of good technical explanation, that came with a commercial VJr upgrade kit from S2 Amps. Though the kit is no longer sold, the information is detailed enough that you could easily buy your own components and do many of these upgrades yourself. I see a couple in there that I may yet do on my own VJr (it never ends!)....

That is a very good document, DVM. I made a hard copy of it awhile ago and put it im my "amplifiers" book.

[Duff]

I have a bad monkey but haven't used it since I got a couple multi effects units: a Digitech RP350 that usb's into the computer, and a really neat Korg AX5G that is plastic but uses batteries or ps and is really full of great sounds without even tweaking but is highly tweakable and has a pedal that works as a selectable vol, wah, or effects depth pedal, also has a default setting for each program you can change. Got the Korg AX5G for 39 price match at GC from printout of Music123 sale. Got an acoustic AX3A, no pedal, I'm experimenting with but my Grate Gunnison 60 watt two channel has some effects built in, not many but good ones.

The bad monkey is nice. I like it but it is fairly heavy overdrive even at the lowest settings. There is a lot of great distortion/overdrive, but not outrageous like a Metal Master or even a Grunge. I like my Grunge though. Fairly heavy distortion/overdrive. My VJr. brand new, (what version would that be?) has great natural overdrive. I'm using it mostly with the Epi 4 by 12 So. Cal. Cab I got for it rather than the matching one 12 that I also have for portability purposes. Those 4 by 12s sing and I got it new for 199. The one 12 is like 130. I can now also get a more powerful head.

Bad monkey is something I won't sell though. It has great tone. Way superior to my Metal Master. My Boss OD-3 is neat though and has a lot less overdrive if you are looking for something that you can turn the overdrive down on.

[F_BSurfer]

Ok after starting some mods to the stock board I decided to go full tilt!! Had most everything except the board ,tube sockets and the sozo caps so did not have to invest much more into it. Now that it is done I am totally happy with it.No more hum and its got some serious balls now,gain might be a little over the top I think if I did the tone mod it would curb that some,will wait get some more playing time and see??Just sounds way cool through my 2x10 cab!!

[duhvoodooman]

Very cool! Nice job there, FBS! :AOK: :dude: :bravo:

Got clips?? :poke:

[F_BSurfer]

No don't have any clips no way to record right now one of these days I am going to get a 57,but right now gear budget going to a few amp builds......Two more builds and one rebuild then I'll be set........ I think??????? Plan then is to pick up couple 57's ,multi track digital recorder (something like Boss Br 900 cd) and a looper.

The last pic is not how the VJR finished out I wound up rerouting some wires the tied down excess for a cleaner look.......Have pull the chassis to cool down bias some will take final pic then