HNPD: Cool Cat Transparent OD

[tot_Ou_tard]

Straight from a post today on TGP from Paul Cochrane:

I'm all for guys saving money. That's why I've done everything i could to keep the prices as low as i could even though the used prices are around 2x what i sell them for. I've never jacked up the price even though I could. I've wanted to do right by the players.

Now I'm seeing that a lot of players don't care about that stuff. Maybe i should have jacked up the price to make as much as i could while it was hot without worrying about the players...

The thing is that people don't have to have this pedal. If they don't buy my pedal it will not effect their lives. In my case if people don't buy my pedal it does. I'm out of work, and I can't support my family.

If people buy the clone ment to undercut me they save the price of a couple of pizzas. This is a one time savings for them of not very much. But for me it's pretty serious. If everybody goes with the clone of my product than I'm out of work in just a few months.

People are wanting the sounds that my pedal produce, but another company has come in and decided to sell it for less than I do. Some guys are looking at it like the player wins without seeing that I lose. It's very depressing seeing that attitude towards me - "I want what paul makes, but I don't want to pay him for it". so what happens is Dano wins by making a sale. The player wins buy getting something that does what I designed it to. I'm the one that's lost because my only source of income has been taken away from my family in a time where there are no new jobs.

And no matter what the opinons of others are this is how I feel about this. I'm the one missing out in this deal, and I'm the one that made the damn things.

PaulC
tim/timmy pedals
myspace.com/paulcaudio

[Robert****]

Danelectro has posted on TGP saying they will alter the circuit so that it's not a clone of Paul's pedal.

[tunghaichuan***]

I've been following this controversy on The Gear Page and freestompboxes.org, where someone reverse engineered the TO and discovered it was the same as the Timmy circuit.

I feel for Paul because I can understand how frustrated he feels in trying to feed his family with something that he designed only to have a large corporation copy it and sell it cheaper.

OTOH, I don't think it is fair to attack Danelectro for copying a circuit and not all the others who have cloned circuits (e.g. Ibanez Tube Screamer). In fact most of the "boutique" ODs are either direct or slightly tweaked TS copies.

TGP is a strange place. The posters there seem to be very selective in whom they attack. I've seen several threads where posters have asked for the best clone of a certain piece of gear, namely the aformentioned TS and even the Soldano SLO. No one from Ibanez protested all the cloners making TS copies and Mike Soldano didn't protest people making clones of his amps. No one from TPG came to the defense of Ibanez or Soldano, either.

Another thing that bothers me about the TGP is all the real Tim and Timmy pedals being sold for much more than the current retail price. I must have seen at least 10-20 in the last month. Nobody from TGP has jumped in and called the gougers on making money off of Paul's design. Paul is so backlogged with orders that anyone with a Tim or Timmy pedal can charge $75-$100 over list price and get it. All so that the buyer doesn't have to wait a few months. This hurts Paul too as the sale could have gone to him instead of making an opportunistic seller an extra $100. Where is the ethics discussion in regard to this? I've even heard sellers boast that they ordered a second pedal only to sell it and make a profit.

My understanding of the situation is that the only protection Paul has is over the name, layout and physical appearance of his product. He can't copyright a circuit. He had to have patented it. But since he didn't, he has no legal protection. I'm not a patent attorney, but looking at the circuit, I don't know if he even could have gotten a patent for it.

tung

[Spudman***]

Well said. It does seem as if folks are being overly selective. I'm glad that you said this.

I've been following this controversy on The Gear Page and freestompboxes.org, where someone reverse engineered the TO and discovered it was the same as the Timmy circuit.

I feel for Paul because I can understand how frustrated he feels in trying to feed his family with something that he designed only to have a large corporation copy it and sell it cheaper.

OTOH, I don't think it is fair to attack Danelectro for copying a circuit and not all the others who have cloned circuits (e.g. Ibanez Tube Screamer). In fact most of the "boutique" ODs are either direct or slightly tweaked TS copies.

TGP is a strange place. The posters there seem to be very selective in whom they attack. I've seen several threads where posters have asked for the best clone of a certain piece of gear, namely the aformentioned TS and even the Soldano SLO. No one from Ibanez protested all the cloners making TS copies and Mike Soldano didn't protest people making clones of his amps. No one from TPG came to the defense of Ibanez or Soldano, either.

Another thing that bothers me about the TGP is all the real Tim and Timmy pedals being sold for much more than the current retail price. I must have seen at least 10-20 in the last month. Nobody from TGP has jumped in and called the gougers on making money off of Paul's design. Paul is so backlogged with orders that anyone with a Tim or Timmy pedal can charge $75-$100 over list price and get it. All so that the buyer doesn't have to wait a few months. This hurts Paul too as the sale could have gone to him instead of making an opportunistic seller an extra $100. Where is the ethics discussion in regard to this? I've even heard sellers boast that they ordered a second pedal only to sell it and make a profit.

My understanding of the situation is that the only protection Paul has is over the name, layout and physical appearance of his product. He can't copyright a circuit. He had to have patented it. But since he didn't, he has no legal protection. I'm not a patent attorney, but looking at the circuit, I don't know if he even could have gotten a patent for it.

tung

[marnold***]

Kudos to Danelectro. They really were under no obligation to do that. Tung, I'm not a patent lawyer either but my guess is that there would be plenty of prior art to invalidate the patent. If Ibanez (if you can even originally trace it to them) had patented the Tube Screamer design, there basically wouldn't be a boutique pedal market.

I'd also guess that people were more likely to jump on Danelectro because these are Chinese made, mass-produced pedals. It seems that nothing gets people's undies in a bundle quite like that. Many of the boutique clone manufacturers are American. Is it fair? No. Is it arbitrary? Yes. Is it borderline xenophobia? Mayhaps. Is it surprising? Not for a nanosecond.

[duhvoodooman***]

It seems to me that Paul is also ignoring the free publicity he's gotten from all this. I wonder how many people who read through that TGP thread and had never even heard of the Timmy may end up buying one, for whatever reason. Also, the "can't feed my family" comment rings a bit hollow to me, given that he has a months-long waiting list. As long as Danelectro has agreed to change the circuit (which I give them a lot of credit for doing, since there is apparently no reason that they need to do so, from a legality standpoint), I really wonder if this will hurt him at all. Until his waiting list drops to zero, he hasn't actually lost a single sale--he's selling everything he can make, until that point is reached.

[Blaze]

It seems to me that Paul is also ignoring the free publicity he's gotten from all this. I wonder how many people who read through that TGP thread and had never even heard of the Timmy may end up buying one, for whatever reason. Also, the "can't feed my family" comment rings a bit hollow to me, given that he has a months-long waiting list. As long as Danelectro has agreed to change the circuit (which I give them a lot of credit for doing, since there is apparently no reason that they need to do so, from a legality standpoint), I really wonder if this will hurt him at all. Until his waiting list drops to zero, he hasn't actually lost a single sale--he's selling everything he can make, until that point is reached.

+10

[markb]

What Tung said and what DVM said. I also agree with Marnold that some of the venom spouted on TGP is precisely because the Danos are made in China. I'd be more convinced of the righteous anger if it were aimed at the parent company, whoever and wherever they may be. TGPers seem quite happy living with their Grolsh/Nash/K-line/Danocaster/etc etc. Fender guitar clones.

[Robert****]

Yeah my thinking is also, if the circuit design isn't patented, can you really complain? I completely agree with DVM and Tung's and Marnold's posts too.

[bigoldron]

Haven't read or followed this thread, but from the last few comments I'm seeing, it sounds like a case of "sour grapes". I got one of those Cool Cat TOD's and it totally RAWKS! I can see why this Paul guy is upset. It sounds way good to me. But, as you some of you pointed out, there's no problem with cloning somebody else's pedal and he's got more orders than he can handle. So, what's the problem? Get over it, dude!

[markb]

OK, I've had a while with the TOD now. Here are my thoughts.

1. It has way too much boost. I rarely get the level beyond 10 o/c.
2. Despite that it's a great low to medium gain pedal. Cut the treble and bass controls and it's TS-like, boost them and it's much more open.
3. More open, yes, but there's still a mid hump.
4. It is possible to get harsh tones out of this pedal but that just illustrates the range available on the tone controls.
5. It loves my tele and it's great for kicking the blackface tones of my TM60 into tweedland (better than the TM's "tweed" emulation).

I'm currently running it with Gain ~ 12:30, Bass 9:00, Treble 11:00, Volume (for a slight boost over bypass) ~ 10:00 with a strat. With the tele I pump up the tone controls (more mids in that guitar) and cut the volume to compensate.

Conclusion: Keeper :

[Robert****]

I just got my Transparent Overdrive today! Yeeehaaaww!

I bet these will go for $200 on eBay in the near future.

[Duff49]

Got a Wasabi Overdrive today from Danelectro and don't know how it compares to the Cool Cat but it sounds great with single coils and humbuckers.

Don't know what the circuit is but it produces some sounds that I like a lot.

Got it for twenty nine on the stupid deal.


Duffy