6L6 Vs. EL84

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Is the scooped sound more a function of the 6L6s, the tone stack, or some other part of the amph?

I would say that the 6L6 has a contribution to that, but it's very small. The main culprit is the tone stack. Before the 5F1 I had a small Fender Champ 600 RI which is a slightly modified blackface circuit with a very pronounced mid scoop. That's why I sold it and got the 5F1, actually. The 5F1 is a tweed, not a blackface model circuit, and it gives you more mids.

So IMHO the scooped thing is really a function of the blackface Champ circuit, not so much a function of the power tube.

As for the chime, by chime I don't really mean high end in itself. I mean shimmer - well, it's hard to explain sounds in words .

[tot_Ou_tard]

I would say that the 6L6 has a contribution to that, but it's very small. The main culprit is the tone stack. Before the 5F1 I had a small Fender Champ 600 RI which is a slightly modified blackface circuit with a very pronounced mid scoop. That's why I sold it and got the 5F1, actually. The 5F1 is a tweed, not a blackface model circuit, and it gives you more mids.

So IMHO the scooped thing is really a function of the blackface Champ circuit, not so much a function of the power tube.

As for the chime, by chime I don't really mean high end in itself. I mean shimmer - well, it's hard to explain sounds in words .

Ahhhh, shimmer. That's a different beast than chime. I'm a shimmer-hound, I love the stuff.


I have a Champion 600 reissue and a Gries 5, both champ-based with an 6V6.


The Gries 5 allows one to dial out the tonestack and so move between a blackface and something similar to a 5F1 tweed or any stop in between.

With the tonestack dialed out the amp has more mids & harmonic content & can get significantly louder.

My experience is that the 6V6 is a sweet, rich tube that in a single ended amp can shimmer 'tll there's no tomorrow.

I have only briefly owned an EL84-based amp (H&K 20th anniversary). I cannot really recall, but my recollections is that the clean channel on that amp was brighter & chimier.

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I have only briefly owned an EL84-based amp (H&K 20th anniversary). I cannot really recall, but my recollections is that the clean channel on that amp was brighter & chimier.

With the outmost respect for your experience: brighter, definitely; chimier, no way .
Either that, or I've lost too much perceived high end in my ears .

EDIT: Sorry, I've missed the "clean channel" part - you might have a point there, I'm not sure how the clean channel uses the circuit but it's not chime-defficient, definitely. I still think that the 5F1 and other 6L6 based-amps are more chime-friendly, mind you. Perhaps chime means some low end factored in as well?

[tot_Ou_tard]

With the outmost respect for your experience: brighter, definitely; chimier, no way .
Either that, or I've lost too much perceived high end in my ears .

Well, I did preface my remark with some mumblings about how uncertain my recollection was .


I am trying to work out how many dimensions respect exists in---whether outmost is the same as utmost or perhaps just almost.

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I am trying to work out how many dimensions respect exists in---whether outmost is the same as utmost or perhaps just almost.

I apologize, I definitely did not mean to start anything. English is not my native language and sometimes that shows regardless of my efforts. I meant "utmost", and it was not meant ironically.

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I apologize, I definitely did not mean to start anything. English is not my native language and sometimes that shows regardless of my efforts. I meant "utmost", and it was not meant ironically.

I was just goofing around, I knew you did not mean it ironically. :

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I was just goofing around, I knew you did not mean it ironically. :

It's always possible that what I hear is not what other people hear, and like I've said in my edit for the post, the clean channel does have some chime, I was actually thinking about a 5F1 turned about more than halfway up, and the corresponding dirt on a typical EL84 amp. Obviously I did not express myself clearly enough.

P.S.: In my limited experience, the H&K amps sound very sterile - they're well built and everything but lack, for the lack of a better word, feeling/character. When I think of EL84's I think of Marshalls.