Amphs in the wind..all we are is..

[tot_Ou_tard]

I've been twisting in the crosscurrents of my various & sundry desires--what should I beg St Nick to haul down my chimney this winter?

I was going to post this under the aegis of the rather chewy phrase "Culminating an Appreciation" recently forged at the Nelskie Mint. Which I think is a rough synonym for GAS and is loosely translated here as "Buying a Cab."

I am not certain that a cab is what I want---those damnable winds again---but I have penned a bestseller titled:

"If I were to buy a cab, here's what I would have bought."

Or rather "what should I buy?"

The cab would be to give the AD30VT more room to breath and to make a nice little nest for a future baby Valve Jr head. The missus hinted that she might be "with child".

So...

1) 2 x 12? 4 x 10?
2) Avatar, Earcandy,...?
3) Celestions, Emminence...?
4) 30 watt, 60,..more?
5) I guess that I would need 8 Ohm, but is that correct?

Thanks & happy chimney stuffing and other assorted holiday activities!

[Tone2TheBone]

Number 2) - Avatar in 2x12.

[tot_Ou_tard]

Number 2) - Avatar in 2x12.

I was thinking of just that.

This'll be played in my basement so I can't really crank it.

I don't know the basic differences between a 2x12 and a 4x10. OK, I know the former has two 12' speakers while the latter has four ten inch ones.

What I don't know is the how their sound characteristics differ & whether one needs to crank them up to the point of having the cones distort in order to hear the difference.

[Tone2TheBone]

I would say that 4x10s could be tighter in the low end. At least from a bass player's point of view. I'd think the same of a guitar running through it although I think 2x12s are better voiced for a more midrangy instrument like a crankin' electric. I would say that 2x12s will produce more frequency range with a guitar. A 4x12 sound is monsterous though...projects like no other. I really liked the sound of oldguy's Avatar cab. I think Robert has one too.

[Spudman***]

2x12. It will be the most tonally flexible and portable bang for the buck. Can be wired in stereo too for use with 2 amph heads.

[tot_Ou_tard]

2x12. It will be the most tonally flexible and portable bang for the buck. Can be wired in stereo too for use with 2 amph heads.

I never would have thought of that. Would I need a A/B/Y box to use two heads through the same cab?

[Plank_Spanker]

I never would have thought of that. Would I need a A/B/Y box to use two heads through the same cab?

Not if the cab is wired for stereo operation (two input jacks).

[tot_Ou_tard]

Not if the cab is wired for stereo operation (two input jacks).

But I would need a stereo guitar or a Y-cable or someway to get the signal from my guitar to the two heads first wouldn't I?

[Plank_Spanker]

But I would need a stereo guitar or a Y-cable or someway to get the signal from my guitar to the two heads first wouldn't I?

An A/B/Y box would do it. A "Y" cable from the guitar to two amps isn't a good idea. You can run into nasty ground loop issues with it and it saps signal strength. A good A/B/Y box will isolate the outputs from each other and the guitar to eliminate that. I use a Framptone amp switcher and it's very transparent.

There are also effects that split to stereo. My Boss chorus does.

[tot_Ou_tard]

Thanky Spanky!

Mind if I ask a few more questions?

Open back or closed? I'm think open, I don't need to project in my basement.

Watts? The wattage issue really confuses me. I'll be using my AD30VT (after I wire in a speaker out) and a Valve Jr. My guess is that the lower wattage the speakers are rated for the easier it will be for these amps to drive them. Is that correct?

I'm searching the net for a site that explains such arcana.

Post'em if you've got'em.

Vood, I'm looking at you!

Thanks!

I just found this:

AMP Wattage!

Please understand one thing. Most amps are rated for their advertised RMS wattage at clean signals. On most amps that's going to be at 2 on the volume knob. So your 100 watt Marshall puts out 100 watts at 2. You like to play it at 7, and if your amp is healthy, that's when it puts out 150-180 watts (or more). The guys at Marshall knew what they were doing when they put the "100" logo in the corner of the cabs, but that still meant that you needed two of them to handle a 100 watt amp that put out 180 watts at the levels you set the amp! Get your amp tested for it's real output wattage, no one likes the smell of a melted speaker, OK? Always figure you need twice your RMS wattage in speaker power handling to safely run your amp on 10.

If you get two 30 watt speakers to run with your 50 watt amp, and dime it, they'll be good to go for awhile. I don't know what timeframe "awhile" is. I've safely done it for 2 hours straight, without issues. I have not done that for extended periods, so you want to take that into consideration with all the OD pedals, clean boosts, and so forth that push speakers to raise your level for solos. Use your good old common sense here. Sure, your old small block sounded great and was running awesome at 8000 rpm for "awhile", then the crank, piston, or connecting rod broke, and you weren't mobile anymore. Use the same common sense judgment with choosing your speaker wattage.

[Plank_Spanker]

Thanky Spanky?

Mind if I ask a few more questions?

Open back or closed? I'm think open, I don't need to project in my basement.

Watts? The wattage issue really confuses me. I'll be using my AD30VT (after I wire in a speaker out) and a Valve Jr. My guess is that the lower wattage the speakers are rated for the easier it will be for these amps to drive them. Is that correct?

I'm searching the net for a site that explains such arcana.

Post'em if you've got'em.

Vood, I'm looking at you!

Thanks!

Open / Closed back - depends on the sound you're looking for. Closed back cabs have a more authorative bottom end than open backs do...at least to my ears.

Watts - this gets into the "speaker breakup" argument. Lower rated speakers break up (distort) at lower volumes and add their own color to the sound. Again, it depends on the sound you seek. You at least want a cab that can handle the rated output of the amp. Speaker selection is also critical. They all sound and react differently. I'm a fan of Celestions. I have Vintage 30's (60 watts) loaded in my Mesa 4x12 and Johnson combo. I have Vintage Greenbacks in the Germino. To my ears, the V30's are voiced for a bigger bottom end and have a more rounded sound than the Greenbacks. The Greenbacks are the voice of classic rock - they're 25 watt speakers and break up fairly early in the amp's range. There are many good speakers to choose from.

Be sure to get a cab that matches your amp's output impedance. While most amps can handle a mismatch, you always get the best power transfer with matched cabs.

I'll dig around for some sites. Think I have a few in favorites.

[tot_Ou_tard]

I really appreciate everyone's help.

If price was no issue would you get a 4x12 or a 2x12...why?

[duhvoodooman***]

If price was no issue would you get a 4x12 or a 2x12...why?

If price was no issue, I'd get.....one of each.

Seriously, unless you're gigging in fairly large venues or trying to be heard above an overzealous drummer, a 4x12 seems like overkill. The 2x12 seems to me to be the more flexible choice. Big enough to push serious air, not outrageously large for home/small room use. Much easier on the back, too!

Take it from Robert, whose advice was excellent, I thought--that 2x12 Avatar cab is a great choice!

[tot_Ou_tard]

Thanks Vood.

It seems to be a trifecta; Spudz, Robert, n' Vood. Can't beat that.

[Spudman***]

If price was no issue would you get a 4x12 or a 2x12...why?

IF price were no issue I would go for the Ear Candy top of the line 1x12. Otherwise a 2x12 from anyone.

[Plank_Spanker]

I'd go with a 2x12. They're much easier to haul around.

[tot_Ou_tard]

IF price were no issue I would go for the Ear Candy top of the line 1x12. Otherwise a 2x12 from anyone.

Why the 1x12 Spudder?

[tot_Ou_tard]

How about a vote? All cabs prices include speakers.

First up: the Earcandy Sovereign 1x12 @ $329-$349
http://www.earcandycabs.com/sovereign.htm

Next up: the Avatar Premium Vintage 212 Custom @ $379
http://www.avatarspeakers.com/Vintage%20Premier.htm

Finally the Avatar G412 Special @ $378
http://www.avatarspeakers.com/G412%20SPECIAL.htm

[Spudman***]

Why the 1x12 Spudder?

Because they are awesome! Go to their web site and look for some links to soundclips of guys using them. That 1x12 can perform as well as most 4x12's.