Your favorite modeling for recording "amph"

[Tone2TheBone]

Oldguy suggested I post this question. I've been talking with him and a few others about their recording modelers. What I'd like to know is what you use and why do you think it's the best. Name some great features for those of us thinking about investing in a unit. Cost of units etc.

[SuperSwede]

Ok, here we go:



Vox Tonelab:

Price: List price 600usd but 299.95 usd from ZZsounds seems to be the current cheapest price.

Unique features: It does use a 12ax7 tube for its fantastic valve reactor technology.

Why this is the best unit today: It simply creates awesome emulations of the most sought after classic tube amps, anything from twangin´tweed to screaming Marshall solos
Also, the very amp-like user interface makes this modeler a breeze even for the non-techie guitarist, there is no hidden sub-menus at all.

Whats bad with this unit:
No solid state modeling (I´m not joking, some of use actually like that!! )
Some of the built in pedal effects are average, especially the acoustic sim & compressor.

[Jimi75]

I just recently bought the Line6 Toneport.

Price: 129€ - approx. 99USD

The Toneport consist of a Hardware component which is the toneport and is nothing else than a very fast soundcard that let you record in superb quality, plus the Gearbox Software where you can chose from a huge variety of Amps, boxes and effects. Also it has a feature called direct monitoring, so you have almost no latency or at least the human ear can not hear the latency.

What's cool about it:
No more Amp standing around in my room. The modeling is over the top, especially the Bassman and Line6's own amp creations. With the software you have an online tuner and a full programmable metronom! Furthermore you have a window where you just press tone library. Gearbox connects with the internet, you type in a name e.g. "Clapton" and it gives you a variety of Clapton sounds. Then just click "get the tone" and it opens up immediately in your gearbox. Furthermore you have 5 bassamp models plus vocal preamps!

This is so fantastic and amazing!

What is not so cool about it?
It makes you an adict sooner as you want to understand. No I am just kidding!

This recording tool is the best and I mean the best price value you can get! The sounds are really unbelievable and I am very pedantic with guitar amp sounds!

[Spudman***]

I'll second Jimi's pick. The Toneport is a very versatile and simple to use machine. It's easy to find a place for and patches for as well. It sounds great.

[SuperSwede]

Hey Spuds, could you give us a little info on your V-amp? I think that this informative thread could be a nice sticky for new players.

*edit* I asked oldguy to move this into the modeling section. I also made it to a sticky post. Feel free to add more info!

[oldguy]

OK. Digitech RP-250, their website has lots of info.

http://www.digitech.com/soundcomm/gu...?productid=226

Here's what I like about it.
Amp models. 5 Fenders,4 Marshalls,2 Vox, 1 HiWatt, 2 Mesa's, 1Matchless, 5Digitech(their own models of modelers), dreadnaught acoustic sim, and direct (no amp). Do they sound just like the real thing? Nope. Can they be tweaked to get close? I think so, I haven't heard all these amps side by side comparison-wise.
Dist.. 13models, ts-9,ts-808,Guyatone,Rat,MXR,Boss,ArbiterFuzzFace,BigMuff, more
I'm not gonna go into every model of every effect, it's too long a list. Suffice it to say there's plenty of tweaking possible, and neccesary, IMO. But spend some time doing the tweaks, and there's some awesome tone in there, I promise.
Cab. simulations, EQ, all the standard effects, wah models, and more.
Built in tuner, 60 drum patterns, plus metronome, and USB to computer.
The expression pedal can be linked to almost any 1 parameter of any effect. I enjoy being able to adjust speed, or depth, or pan of tremelo, dist, phaser, reverb, gain, volume on amps, you name it, it's a nice feature. Plus it doubles as a wah, stomp down on the toe, it's the wah you choose (Crybaby, Clyde,etc), stomp again, back to expression parameter you set.
I believe the X-Edit feature is my favorite, and I didn't think I'd use it!
Download the free drivers, hook it up USB, and tweak presets quick and easy, then save 'em to your computer, the choice is yours to load them onto the unit or not. I think the RP-250 section of the online sound community has about 150 user patches so far. I've downloaded most of them, I found a few I liked. You can preview them by running them through the unit and listening to them, if you like them you go to "device" and "store". Otherwise leave 'em on your computer to tweak another day.
I think I'm getting some really good sounds out of this unit, but it took some tweaking, and the X-Edit is lots easier than knob twisting, plus it offers more flexibility (more EQ'ing, etc) than the knobs alone. Without it you're only getting about 75% of what the unit can do.
And it's $150.

Here's what I don't like
Digitech Whammy...doesn't track smooth, if you're "whammying" (is that a word?) up or down an octave, it "warbles", unless you sweep the pedal fast
Bass sim...same thing, more than one note at a time and the "bass" sound becomes a "BwAAhhWHATthefnote do you want from me????" sound.
The 60 user presets that can be edited are clones of the next factory 60 that can't be edited, and about 40 of them are sh*t, IMO. So you get about 20 good presets right outta the box, and 40 more you can make good, and 20 more factory that are good, and 40 you can't do a damn thing with. I guess 60 good user presets are plenty, I haven't got that many tweaked yet, but still it's a waste of 40, IMO.
And finally, lest anyone think I'm pushing anybody else to buy Digitech....and to answer Tone's original post.
This IS what I use.
I don't think it's the best. There are modelers out there that cost 10X as much. There's a reason why.
I do think it's the best bang for the buck, and was available in my part of the world when I wanted one. Ever have the GAS so bad you can't wait 5 days for UPS to show up? I have.

Seriously, there are many fine modelers out there nowadays in all price ranges. And there's no reason to limit yourself. Buy what you like today, and tomorrow go compare and buy something else. I've got four amphs and love 'em all. Why should modeling amphs be any different?

[Spudman***]

The VAmp 2 is essentially a bunch of amps in a little blue box. It doesn't have a lot of effect parameters like a POD, but still it's got most everything you need for a modeling amp with effects. It's simple yet effective. I've heard plenty of great sounding songs where this was the only amp.

The specs can be found at http://www.behringer.com/V-AMP2/index.cfm?lang=ENG

Like all modelers, patches for it can be found all over the web. There are also at least 3 computer interfaces available for free. This makes editing via computer a snap. You do however need 2 midi cables and a midi interface for your sound card to use the onscreen editing function. Also, like every other modeler out there, the real proof of sound quality can only really be found out by editing your own patches. Choose an amp - dial in some effects (or not) - play. It's pretty quiet, but my house AC is not, so I get some hum on my recordings. There is a built in noise gate that works very well.

It comes with a Codura padded carry bag and a foot pedal for incrementing patches up and down. All this for around $99. So, for the cost of single effect pedal you can have a whole lot of amps and effects to either play through an amplifier or into a computer for recording. Pretty good deal if you ask me.

[6STRINGS 9LIVES]

FANTASTIC , info gentelmen .. thanks for taking the time .. those who have read my posts have no doubt become aware of my fanaticism for tubage and vintage tone , but believe it or not I am looking hard at venturing into the modeling arena .. but like most ,i find the choices a little overwhelming ,.
I think what we are seeing in the area of guitar and sound amplification is no so much an evolution as a revolution, the future is now .. I remain steadfast in my belief that vintage tube tone is undeniably sweeter but there is no denying that the time has come to adjust the blinders and see just what is available and just how good it really is , that and the price and scarcity of original vintage tube gear it only makes sense to look to modeling as a way to achieve the tone and keep the old stuff at home and off the road just to protect it from wear and tear and possible theft etc .. anyway great thread and bring on the information ..I'm all ears .

[Spudman***]

6S9L
If you are curious how modelers sound in the hands of professionals...The last two Porcupine Tree albums, Deadwing and In Absentia have the POD XT throughout them. Also, the latest The Flower Kings album Paradox Hotel has modeler all over it, but you can't tell where and Roine isn't telling either. He is one of the ultimate tone guys and very picky about guitar sound since he's produced and played on about a gazillion albums.

Edit: I almost forgot. Any Ayreon album features POD Pro exclusively for the guitars. They sound amazing.

This goes to show that in that environment it almost doesn't make a difference which you use, amp or modeler. The results speak for themselves.

[oldguy]

Gentlemen, for your consideration...
Take an amph, (my 65 Blackface Super, for instance)...
Add a modeler...
I don't want to destroy the sound of my vintage amph...
Turn the amph models off...add the effects you like..(dual chorus, TS808, Lexicon Reverb, instead of the Fender tank, some slight compression, maybe a hint of delay, either digital or analog modeled type...)...
Set the expression pedal to control the depth of the chorus, or the level of the distortion, or the regeneration of the delay, or whatever suits you...
Try this playing live, and I believe you have the best of both worlds.
Modelers have a great sound for direct recording, and can sound awesome live as well. However, if you are addicted (as I am) to the touch/feel of a tube amph cranked to the sweet spot of even order harmonics, bordering on a "WHUMPH!" of air pounding your chest ever not-so-slightly(make sense so far?) I believe if you take this taste-test live you will be hooked!
This is what I was talking to Tone about when we discussed starting this thread.

[Spudman***]

Modelers have a great sound for direct recording, and can sound awesome live as well. However, if you are addicted (as I am) to the touch/feel of a tube amph cranked to the sweet spot of even order harmonics, bordering on a "WHUMPH!" of air pounding your chest ever not-so-slightly(make sense so far?) I believe if you take this taste-test live you will be hooked!
This is what I was talking to Tone about when we discussed starting this thread.

So does anyone get this happening when playing a modeling amph live?

[Tone2TheBone]

I agree with 6 here....thanks you guys for giving so much information on your units. This helps beginning modellers like ME in a big way!

[SuperSwede]

Thanks everone for your posts. Could someone with a POD post some info as well?

[Tone2TheBone]

Speaking of POD....there's a used "original POD" at MGR for $99.00....it's not the PODxt but just regular POD....is this a decent unit?

[SuperSwede]

Is it the Pod 1.0 or 2.0 ?

[Spudman***]

Whatever POD you get make sure that it has a USB port. You'll want one.

[Tone2TheBone]

I don't know what model it is...it's burgundy like the XT and looks almost the same. The guy at the store told me it was like the generation before the XT (he has the new Bass PODxt??) and he did say that it's got USB out and I could download patches and stuff for it still. Does that sound right? I know NOT-TING about these things.

Edited to add:

Based on Ebay searches I'm pretty sure it's the 2.0 model. But I only see mention of Midi cable out and not USB. But shouldn't there be a regular 1/4" jack out? I can just run the unit out to my soundcard like that. I do that with my Shure mic now anyway and it sounds great. What do you guys think?

[SuperSwede]

The Pod 2.0 sounds good, but it obviously doesnt have a real display (which is very very handy). Otherwise its a good modeler (not up to par with the latest Vox & Line6 offerings though)

[Tone2TheBone]

Well it's only $99 and right now that's the appeal. But I'm getting decent recording levels mic'ing the amph so I'll go old school until I can get something new and GOOD.