Strugglecaster

[tot_Ou_tard]

Strats are often praised for their versatility. I think one of the reasons is that it plays well with effects. That is, a variously effected strat is versatile.

But the thing I'm really trying to understand is statements like this from another thread:

My mid boosts are the Hot British and the ZYS, but I still love my old friends the Strats for their "thing" that you have to work to get.

I've read this over and over again. That you have to struggle with a strat to have it give up the goods. What does this mean? Is it true? Why is that?

[tunghaichuan***]

My personal experience is that strats are harder to play than Gibson type guitars. With a strat you have a longer scale, so you have more string tension. A vintage strat also has a smaller fretboard radius so the strings have to be farther away from the fretboard as not to fret out. Stock strat pickups are weaker output and thinner sounding than humbuckers. So you really have to fight a strat to get good tones out of it

Personally, I don't like traditional humbuckers, they sound muddy and indistinct to me. Strat pickups sound clear and articulate. For me, this works better with chorus, delay, and other modulation type FX. This is just my own personal preference.

The last Gibson scale guitar I owned, I sold about 15 year ago. It was an 80s Ibanez Artist, which is basically a double cutaway Les Paul. That guitar practically played itself. I just couldn't get used to it having played Strat-style guitars almost exclusively.

My $.02

Strats are often praised for their versatility. I think one of the reasons is that it plays well with effects. That is, a variously effected strat is versatile.

But the thing I'm really trying to understand is statements like this from another thread:

I've read this over and over again. That you have to struggle with a strat to have it give up the goods. What does this mean? Is it true? Why is that?

[R_of_G]

My personal experience is that strats are harder to play than Gibson type guitars. With a strat you have a longer scale, so you have more string tension. A vintage strat also has a smaller fretboard radius so the strings have to be farther away from the fretboard as not to fret out. Stock strat pickups are weaker output and thinner sounding than humbuckers. So you really have to fight a strat to get good tones out of it

Personally, I don't like traditional humbuckers, they sound muddy and indistinct to me. Strat pickups sound clear and articulate. For me, this works better with chorus, delay, and other modulation type FX. This is just my own personal preference.

The last Gibson scale guitar I owned, I sold about 15 year ago. It was an 80s Ibanez Artist, which is basically a double cutaway Les Paul. That guitar practically played itself. I just couldn't get used to it having played Strat-style guitars almost exclusively.

My $.02

couldn't agree more. i was playing earlier and was looking to find some new tones with some effects. the strat was already plugged in so i went with that. after about 30 min of annoyance at how thin the tones were, i went to the gibson and got what i was looking for. the strat is great for me when i play certain things [particularly punk] but for everything else i play, i love my gibson and/or crave a tele.

[tot_Ou_tard]

My personal experience is that strats are harder to play than Gibson type guitars. With a strat you have a longer scale, so you have more string tension. A vintage strat also has a smaller fretboard radius so the strings have to be farther away from the fretboard as not to fret out. Stock strat pickups are weaker output and thinner sounding than humbuckers. So you really have to fight a strat to get good tones out of it

Does fight here mean "use effects", but it's hard to dial them in correctly, or does it mean your fingers have to work harder to control those scale, radius issues you mentioned? The combination of the 2? (To quote Janis & Big Brother & The Holding Company.) Or some mysterious third thing?

Personally, I don't like traditional humbuckers, they sound muddy and indistinct to me. Strat pickups sound clear and articulate. For me, this works better with chorus, delay, and other modulation type FX. This is just my own personal preference.

That was what I was suggesting that versatile meant. It plays well with effects. So this is just a property of single coil pups.

Both of my guitars are Gibson-scale bolt-on guitars with 12" radius fretboards and single-coil pups. Although the single-coils on the Godin radiator are non-traditional things. So all of my experience is impure.

I'm hankering for an Eastwood Tuxedo, which is a Fender-scale set-neck hollowbody with a 12" fretboard and hot P90s.

I'll probably die impure.

[tunghaichuan***]

Does fight here mean "use effects", but it's hard to dial them in correctly, or does it mean your fingers have to work harder to control those scale, radius issues you mentioned? The combination of the 2? (To quote Janis & Big Brother & The Holding Company.) Or some mysterious third thing?

What was that middle thing again?

I meant the guitar is physically harder to play than a Gibson-style guitar. It's not hard to dial in modulation FX, but I haven't found a distortion/OD box I'm 100% happy with. Of course, I haven't tried everything and don't have the money to.

That was what I was suggesting that versatile meant. It plays well with effects. So this is just a property of single coil pups.

For me, yes. It is the clear bell-like tones that work well with delays, chorus, flange, etc. But it requires a lot of experimenting to get the distortion/OD tones happening. SRV, Gilmour and Hendrix were masters of this.

Both of my guitars are Gibson-scale bolt-on guitars with 12" radius fretboards and single-coil pups. Although the single-coils on the Godin radiator are non-traditional things. So all of my experience is impure.

My main guitar is a Warmoth strat copy with Seymour Duncan Hot Stack Strat pups. These are single coil sized stacked humbuckers. They aren't as clear and bell-like as true single coils, but they don't make any noise, either. They are kind of half way between humbuckers and single coils in terms of chime, clarity and output. So my experience is impure as well

I'm hankering for an Eastwood Tuxedo, which is a Fender-scale set-neck hollowbody with a 12" fretboard and hot P90s.

Sounds like a very cool guitar.

I'm really jonsing for a Godin Freeway. I'd yank the stock pups and put in a set of EMG-H pickups. These are EMG-SAs in a humbucker housing.

I'll probably die impure.

Won't we all.

tung

[wingsdad]

That was what I was suggesting that versatile meant. It plays well with effects. So this is just a property of single coil pups.
...

I'm hankering for an Eastwood Tuxedo, which is a Fender-scale set-neck hollowbody with a 12" fretboard and hot P90s.

25 1/2" Fender-scale neck, 12" radius, semi-hollow, 'hot' P-90's?

Consider a G&L ASAT (Tele-type) Semi-Hollow. The "stock" G&L #2 neck on ASAT's is a 7 1/2" radius, but you can get one with a "#1" neck, 12" radius. Either is 1 5/8" at the nut, 2 1/4" at the heel.

But it's G&L's Magnetic Field Design (MFD) ceramic magnet single coil pickups that make them stand out with more articulation and definition vs. 'regular' fixed polepiece Tele or Strat single coils. This is why Leo Fender designed them that way: to improve on his original pickup designs for the Tele & Strat. Using individual, adjustable height magnets for each string, as well the pup's being overall height-adjustable at either end. You can really set up the guitar customized to the string gauge and playing style.

On the ASAT Semi-Hollow or ASAT Special, these are 'soapbar' sized, similar to a P-90. On standard ASAT's, they're more the size of a 'normal' Tele bridge or neck pup. The soapbars play a bit hotter and with more range.

[tunghaichuan***]

But it's G&L's Magnetic Field Design (MFD) ceramic magnet single coil pickups that make them stand out with more articulation and definition vs. 'regular' fixed polepiece Tele or Strat single coils. This is why Leo Fender designed them that way: to improve on his original pickup designs for the Tele & Strat. Using individual, adjustable height magnets for each string, as well the pup's being overall height-adjustable at either end. You can really set up the guitar customized to the string gauge and playing style.

Can the G&L MFD pickups be purchased separately?

tung

[hubberjub***]

Though I don't play my Strat enough there are some things I love about them. Most of my guitars are humbucker equipped but when it comes to clean tones and note definition the single coils are the way to go. Humbuckers just sound tubby and too midrangey. While the longer scale will affect string tension the benefit is the low end snap and clarity especially on sub-fifth fret notes. Gibson and Fender style guitars are both tools worth having in the arsenal. There is no better way to stand out in a band if the other guitarist is cranking a Les Paul through a Marshall than to grab a Strat or Tele and get twangin'. The audience will know that you are the sophisticated one.

[Spudman***]

Tung covered the answer real well.

Essentially Strats are temperamental and a little fussy due to the components and set up. I also had an Artist that was a breeze and I still have many short scale guitars that are easy to play as well. Due to my years of playing a variety of guitars I still sound like me when playing those shorter scale axes but it pretty much all came from playing the Strat in the beginning. If you read some Robin Trower interview he says the same thing about Strats. His action is high and he even says that he struggles with them.

It's because of the struggle that the player's personality becomes evident. All that little bit of extra muscle use and thought that go in to playing a Strat make for a unique highly individualized sound.

[tot_Ou_tard]

25 1/2" Fender-scale neck, 12" radius, semi-hollow, 'hot' P-90's?

I should have been more precise. They have old school (think T-bone Walker) Kleenex-box P90s.

Yes, I'm not immune to lusting after various ASATs (the Semihollow Special is high on the list).

[tot_Ou_tard]

It's because of the struggle that the player's personality becomes evident. All that little bit of extra muscle use and thought that go in to playing a Strat make for a unique highly individualized sound.

So it is just physically harder to get the notes to ring clear and with proper intonation, but everyone solves the problem slightly differently and that imparts individuality. Izzat it?

[Spudman***]

So it is just physically harder to get the notes to ring clear and with proper intonation, but everyone solves the problem slightly differently and that imparts individuality. Izzat it?

That's a pretty good summation.

[tot_Ou_tard]

That's a pretty good summation.

It's really just a rewording of what you & tung wrote .

Thanks, I never knew what people meant by that before.

I suppose you could really get some individual sounds by playing telephone lines.

[wingsdad]

Can the G&L MFD pickups be purchased separately?

tung

I think so. Got to the G&L Guitars website and look at the online store. (I'm at work & stealing 2 minutes, otherwise I'd link you).

I forgot to mention in my prior post that the 'target' G&L Strat type tone monster might actually be the S-500. Strat body type, #2 neck, 'strat size' MFD's, Master Bass & Master Treble (vs. a conventional Strat's middle tone, neck tone, bridge what-you-get tone), and 2 pickup modes, the Expanded Mode giving you 2 more combos: the bridge/neck combo and all 3 at once.

They just came out with a Semi-hollow model at Winter NAMM.

The Legacy doesn't use the MFD's, but instead, 'classic' style single coils, fixed pole pieces.

I also forgot to include 'action' as a factor you can compensate for with the adjustable polepieces.

I'll be outathere til late tonite CA time.

[tunghaichuan***]

I think so. Got to the G&L Guitars website and look at the online store. (I'm at work & stealing 2 minutes, otherwise I'd link you).

Thanks, found them.

I forgot to mention in my prior post that the 'target' G&L Strat type tone monster might actually be the S-500. Strat body type, #2 neck, 'strat size' MFD's, Master Bass & Master Treble (vs. a conventional Strat's middle tone, neck tone, bridge what-you-get tone), and 2 pickup modes, the Expanded Mode giving you 2 more combos: the bridge/neck combo and all 3 at once.

That S-500 is killer, way beyond my budget, but killer nonetheless.

tung

[Brian Krashpad]

Funny, of the 2 iconic Fender guitars, the version I always hear is that the Tele is the more difficult to play, and the one to expose your faults quicker.

[hubberjub***]

Funny, of the 2 iconic Fender guitars, the version I always hear is that the Tele is the more difficult to play, and the one to expose your faults quicker.

That's funny because my Telecaster plays like butter but my Strat is a dog.