Has it gone too far?

[Spudman***]

Anyone notice the article in the current Guitar Player magazine on all the low wattage amplifiers?

They look and probably sound great but is $1,200 - $1,800 too much for a less than 20 watt amp?

I think it's nuts.

[sunvalleylaw]

Esp. when the H&K you have was for about 7 - 8 hundred before you got it on blow out for about half that! Lucky Duck!

[aeolian]

I do agree with you that these amps are spendy, but I think there are reasons for it.

I believe building a smaller amp is not much less work than a building a big amp, although the materials do cost more in sum total e.g. another speaker, bigger amperage transformer, whatnot. But these amps are hand built so the labor cost component is higher than building a bigger amp.

Another reason (and may be the main one) is that most guitar players are hobbyist playing at home, and a 50 watt tube amp is just not suitable for home use, but they still are tone hounds who wants the 'best' sounding amp and therefore willing to pay for it. I have to admit I own one of these boutique amps, it is my only tube amp (my AD30VT does not count). At 20 watts and volume set to 2 I can be heard throughout the whole house; if anything I really need a smaller amp but one that can move some air. Also I see many performing artists now just playing through 15-20 watt amps on stage with their amp mic'ed. I take it that that give them the same tone on stage as in practice, although I don't really know because I'm not good enough to play out.

Are they worth the money? All I can say is that my boutique amp sounds better than a Blues Jr. But over $1000 better? That's hard to say. It does bring a smile to my face when I play through it, and that's what the money is paying for.

[sumitomo]

It's a little steep but point to point is alot of work it would cost just as much for a 1 watt.Sumi

[Bloozcat]

Well Spud, I think it's indicative of the level of discretionary income out there. Sure, professionals can afford it, especially as they're necessary tools of their trade. But a lot of the rest of the market is probably baby boomers with income levels that they didn't have when they were struggling 20 something year old musicians. For some guys it's that Harley they always wanted, or that big boat. For others, it's "booteek" music equipment. Mid life toys take on many forms....

Having said all that...I agree with you Spud...it's a little over the top. And I think that's why companies like Epiphone and Blackheart are finding ways to deliver the approximate tone at a fraction of the cost. Good thing too, cause I'm a cheap SOB myself.....

[Robert****]

I think wattage doesn't have so much to do with the costs of making them.

There are lots of variety in pricing of amps, but GP often reviews the really expensive ones, for some reason.

[ZMAN]

I really can't understand the Butyk amps myself. All you need is a blues junior at 15 watts it is all you really need. Probably the best amp out there for that money. Then there is the Blues Deluxe. 22 Watts and tone to die for. OK it is in the 900 to 1000 range but IS the tone most have been looking for. I have a couple of 40 watters in the Vibrolux and the Blues Deluxe Reissue, but they just don't get used.

[street music]

It is just like gasoline, it's something that the consumer will pay the price for and so the price stays high for such items. It is really crazy what some of the guitar companies are asking for a so called hand made guitar, I mean just how much of it isn't hand made. Yes, we can get cheaper made products and sometimes we get a great item at a cheaper price but w all still want to have the best we can get for the money. I want a good acoustic amp but for the time being I have finally got a couple of selections on my Zoom pedal that make my Takamine sound good through my Princeton. I have looked at many acoustic amps in the last year and just can't see the big bucks they want for a better known brand and I'm not comfortable with some of the cheap ones.

[t_ross33]

Also I see many performing artists now just playing through 15-20 watt amps on stage with their amp mic'ed. I take it that that give them the same tone on stage as in practice, although I don't really know because I'm not good enough to play out.

A) If I can play out, ANYONE can

B) You are correct. Smaller wattage amps will tend to hit that "suhweet" spot and break at lower volume and overall sound tighter. If the amp is mic'd, then there is no need for it to be screaming over the drummer, plus many giggers are using in-ear-monitors now so there is a lot more control over stage volume (a good thing IMHO) and less of a need to blast everyone out of the bar with banks upon banks of stacks :

[Spudman***]

Some really good points being brought up here.

"Discretionary income" seems to be the one that sticks in my mind for some reason. A working pro (recording artist) might justify one but then the other point about getting 95% of the tone with something less spendy makes sense too. Folks are still getting great sounds out of cheaper amps. Is it worth it to spend an extra $1,000 or more? Not to me it isn't.

Maybe the low wattage - point to point amps are the new Harley for those with an identity crisis? I can see that with gas prices what they are. Make an investment in a guitar and amp then stay home and ride the couch instead. Much cheaper and you can eat while you ride too.

Point is that you almost have to have some extra $ just sitting around burning a hole in your pocket in order to say to yourself "I think I'll blow $2,000 on an amp that wont even vibrate ants off a mirror." For that kind of money you can get a number of testicle shaking air movers that put "fear" back into the club atmosfear. I guess I'm just the kind of guy that likes a bit of adrenalin brought on from my amp, especially if I'm shelling out that kind of cash.

[Robert****]

But Spud, the 18 watt Dr Z Maz 18 JR NR isn't that bad - it's $1400 and I've played it - it's loud enough for any gig I would do, and it sounds STELLAR. I almost bought one.

However, some boutique amps are just a bit too much dollars, regardless of wattage. I just commented in a different thread about $4,000 for a 100 watt head made by an unknown manufacturer here in Canada. Now that's getting outta hand!

[just strum]

I must really be a cheap sob, because I can't see paying more than $300 - $400 for an amp unless you are doing gigs.

And for small room playing, you could always get one of these.

http://zvexamps.com/amp_view.html

[aeolian]

Since I appear to be the well heeled individual that buys boutique gear I want to explain my strategy.

Firstly, I sometimes come into disposal income; the last time that happened was because I made some money in the stock market. When it comes to gear (boutique or not) I always buy them used. My criteria is to look for gear that I want to evaluate at a price that I believe I can recoup if I don't like it. This way I can tried out some of these more exotic guitars and amps without the risk of losing a lot of money. As long as I have the gear my money is tied up in the gear, but it should be a wash if I turn around and sell it. From that viewpoint it is not much different than the house I live in except the house is a 'necessity.'

[Tibernius]

From that viewpoint it is not much different than the house I live in except the house is a 'necessity.'

And the guitars aren't?

[just strum]

From that viewpoint it is not much different than the house I live in except the house is a 'necessity.'

Of course it is, where else you going to keep the guitars?

[just strum]

And for small room playing, you could always get one of these.

http://zvexamps.com/amp_view.html

Hey, I just noticed, no "hiss"

[aeolian]

Of course it is, where else you going to keep the guitars?

And after that comes my dog, then my children, then my wife. I hope she doesn't read this.

[hubberjub***]

Since I appear to be the well heeled individual that buys boutique gear I want to explain my strategy.

Firstly, I sometimes come into disposal income; the last time that happened was because I made some money in the stock market. When it comes to gear (boutique or not) I always buy them used. My criteria is to look for gear that I want to evaluate at a price that I believe I can recoup if I don't like it. This way I can tried out some of these more exotic guitars and amps without the risk of losing a lot of money. As long as I have the gear my money is tied up in the gear, but it should be a wash if I turn around and sell it. From that viewpoint it is not much different than the house I live in except the house is a 'necessity.'

I must agree with your theory. I too buy only higher end gear but I buy it all used. I haven't bought a piece of gear that I couldn't at least get my money back from. As far as the original topic about amp wattage vs. cost I feel that quality is more important than quantity. I've been gigging all summer with my 20 watt Soldano and it's been great. All but one of my shows have been large outdoor gigs and the amp is always miced. Twenty watts is more than enough for a reasonable stage volume and it allows me to overdrive the power tubes at a tolerable level while still being able to hear everyone else. I've had the one hundred watt Marshall half stack and I will never go back. Yes, for the price of an 18 watt DR. Z I could get a hundred watt stack but how often can you actually use all of that wattage to its full potential. I have enough trouble hearing vocals in the monitors as it is. A huge amp does look cool though.

[bigoldron]

I must really be a cheap sob, because I can't see paying more than $300 - $400 for an amp unless you are doing gigs.

And for small room playing, you could always get one of these.

http://zvexamps.com/amp_view.html

I'm a cheap SOB also, but if I had the dough, I'd probably find a justification for a more expensive amp, but I can't see those boutique's that run over $1,000.

BTW, THAT ZVEXAMP IS TOO COOL!!! MY GAWD, THAT THING RAWKS!!! : :

Wait a minute, I just saw the price - not too cool - but it's still impressive! :