New Ibanez Tube Screamer Model

[duhvoodooman***]

OK, kiddies--this has me shaking my head a bit:

Lookee what Ibanez has come out with to battle all those high-priced poseurs in the "boo-teek" pedal market:

Hand-wired TS808

That's right, a genuine hand-wired TS808 for 3 Benjamins, featuring (and I quote here) "that warm, natural tube overdrive sound previously unattainable by conventional units." Now, why that tone would be "unattainable" isn't real clear to me, but be that as it may, let's do a little comparison:



You can draw your own conclusions...

[markb]

Well as they say "build a better Tube Screamer and the world will beat a path to your door" .

[tunghaichuan***]

Hmm...

I found a shot of the guts a while back but can't seem to find it now Personally, I'd rather have something like this made on a PCB. They are much more consistent.

Your ZYS has more personality for sure.

tung

OK, kiddies--this has me shaking my head a bit:

Lookee what Ibanez has come out with to battle all those high-priced poseurs in the "boo-teek" pedal market:

Hand-wired TS808

That's right, a genuine hand-wired TS808 for 3 Benjamins, featuring (and I quote here) "that warm, natural tube overdrive sound previously unattainable by conventional units." Now, why that tone would be "unattainable" isn't real clear to me, but be that as it may, let's do a little comparison:



You can draw your own conclusions...

[duhvoodooman***]

I found a shot of the guts a while back but can't seem to find it now Personally, I'd rather have something like this made on a PCB. They are much more consistent.

Tung, are you saying that this new Ibanez version is wired point-to-point, with no PCB? When they said hand-wired, I was thinking in terms of the wiring between the PCB, jacks, switch and pots being done by hand, rather than everything being board-mounted.

My ZYS is PCB-based, which I agree is a more consistent and probably much more reliable way to do a pedal, since the space is so confined.

[tunghaichuan***]

Tung, are you saying that this new Ibanez version is wired point-to-point, with no PCB? When they said hand-wired, I was thinking in terms of the wiring between the PCB, jacks, switch and pots being done by hand, rather than everything being board-mounted.

My ZYS is PCB-based, which I agree is a more consistent and probably much more reliable way to do a pedal, since the space is so confined.

Yes, there are two rows of what looked like terminal boards. The pedal is wired point-to-point wired sans PCB.

Edit, here it is:



PCBs are the way to go with pedals.

tung

[ShortBuSX]

Id rather have my Screamin Banshee than that handwired.

[sumitomo]

Hey Voodo you plan on makin' any more ZYS pedals in the future?Sumi

[duhvoodooman***]

When I get some orders, sure! Anybody interested should just PM me....

[marnold***]

What would be the advantage of doing it that way other than to show off the hand wiring? It would seem to make the pedal much more fragile that the PCB method.

[tunghaichuan***]

What would be the advantage of doing it that way other than to show off the hand wiring? It would seem to make the pedal much more fragile that the PCB method.

The advantage of using PCBs is consistency. The layout is set, tested and noise free. There is usually very little variance in component placement due to the boards being made, stuffed and soldered by machines. Hand wiring is much more expensive because each pedal may have to be tweaked due to variances in humans constructing the circuit. Since you have to pay humans to wire the devices, they tend to be more expensive as it takes longer to crank them out.

Hand wired circuits are easier to fix and modify. PCBs tend to be pretty fragile in terms of lifted traces. They also are harder to modify due to the set layout. Terminal boards are much more robust than PCBs.

In terms of pedals, PCBs are better, IMHO. As for amps, hand wired circuits are better when dealing with tubes and high voltages present in amps. PCBs are usually used as a cost-cutting measure for tube amps, which is a bad idea. Great for pedals, bad for high voltage circuits which generate a lot of heat. PCB amps don't have to be bad, some of the best sounding and well constructed amps are built on PCBs: VHT, Bogner, and THD Electronics are all examples of well built, great sounding amps.

tung

[Tone2TheBone]

It seems to me that a ptp pedal with all those long wires big lugs and connections would

a) suck tone

b) pick up radio signals

c) suck tone

with my very limited knowledge...ptp amps yeah pretty cool but ptp pedals...why? Plus that's not half as good looking as my ZYS pedal...and a regular TS-808 old school style.

[duhvoodooman***]

Well, I suppose it's only fitting to show the ZYS inside & out. Here's the last one I built (for a former Fretter that you "old-timers" all know well), incorporating some minor changes over earlier versions. The board on this one was from GGG (BYOC suspended PCB sales for a while). The perfboard at the top incorporates the gain and bass boost components, as well as the MOSFET clippers that I've used to replace the original germanium diode array for the "cool" clipping mode. Nice warm, bluesy tone but without the substantial volume drop of the germaniums. MOSFET clipping is used in the Fulltone Fullldrive 2 and the Hermida MOSferatu OD pedals, so the ZYS is in good company on this!

[Bloozcat]

It sounds like Ibanez has created a solution to a problem that didn't exist...

[Robert****]

DVM, I thought you couldn't get what you need anymore for build this Zonker? I remember you mentioning that a good while ago. Are the parts available now?

[duhvoodooman***]

It seems to me that a ptp pedal with all those long wires big lugs and connections would

a) suck tone

b) pick up radio signals

c) suck tone

Actually, those issues really shouldn't be a concern. The high impedance buffer on the TS should adequately prevent tone-sucking, and once the circuitry is sealed in the metal enclosure, it should be well shielded against radio and other spurious signal sources.

It sounds like Ibanez has created a solution to a problem that didn't exist...

I think this is just a way to make the old TS808 circuit look "sexy" and compete against the many pricey boutique versions/variations of the Tube Screamer technology. It also represents a $130 price jump vs. the TS808 re-issue! You can be sure it didn't cost that much more to produce! Point-to-point wiring has such a "high-end" cachet about it for amp building, for the reasons Tung mentioned. So even though it really serves no value-added function in a 9V pedal (other than looking cool/different), it's use here supports the "hand-wired" description. Pure marketing gimmickry, IMO. Likely to appeal to those who know the terms without understanding what's really behind them, and who have $300 to throw around on what, under the hood, is a straightforward TS808, with no added functionality or flexibility.

DVM, I thought you couldn't get what you need anymore for build this Zonker? I remember you mentioning that a good while ago. Are the parts available now?

BYOC stopped selling the PCB's from their kits a few months back, but they were only unavailable for a month or two. During that time, I found an excellent substitute from General Guitar Gadgets--same circuit, though laid out on the board a bit differently and somewhat more expensive. That's what I used in the ZYS pictured above. So the ZYS was only "out of production" for a short period until I found & tried out the GGG board. It worked great, and I can use it as a backup if the BYOC boards become unavailable again, for whatever reason.

[tunghaichuan***]

I think this is just a way to make the old TS808 circuit look "sexy" and compete against the many pricey boutique versions/variations of the Tube Screamer technology.

One of the dirty little secrets of the boutique pedal market is that many high-dollar pedals are merely copies of Tube Screamers. Some have minor tweaks, others are just blatant copies.

In fact it is this way with lots of pedals. Quite a few pedal builders couldn't design a pedal to save their life. It is just easier to copy a circuit, give it a weird name and put it in a fancy box and sell it for lots of bucks.

Disclaimer: this isn't aimed at Duhvoodooman, he has always been up front about the source of the circuit for his pedal and has done lots of tweaks to make it more versatile. It may have started out as a Tube Screamer, but he made it into something more. Given all the effort he puts into building his pedal, what he charges for it is a steal.

BYOC stopped selling the PCB's from their kits a few months back, but they were only unavailable for a month or two. During that time, I found an excellent substitute from General Guitar Gadgets--same circuit, though laid out on the board a bit differently and somewhat more expensive. That's what I used in the ZYS pictured above. So the ZYS was only "out of production" for a short period until I found & tried out the GGG board. It worked great, and I can use it as a backup if the BYOC boards become unavailable again, for whatever reason.

I think the BYOC boards are available again:

http://www.buildyourownclone.com/pcb.html

Get 'em while they're hot. :

tung

[TS808]

It IS a TS808 though

Handwired is definitely the craze these days. I can't comment much on that, but does handwired really make that much of a difference in tone?

[Rocket]

...does handwired really make that much of a difference in tone?

Electrons don't care.

[duhvoodooman***]

Electrons don't care.